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2nd POV code

REP 🚫

I was chatting with Aroslav about his assigning 2nd POV as one of his story codes. He believes many readers interpret that to mean the story is told from multiple points of view, so he assigns that code.

Aroslav's rationale may be why many authors on this site assign the 2nd POV code to stories that are not written using 2nd POV.

I think a 'Multiple View Points' code would be more accurate for his use and suggest it be added.

I can see a use for the code by authors who feel it is important to let their readers know that there are multiple view points in the story.

Replies: Switch Blayde Ernest Bywater awnlee jawking

Switch Blayde 🚫
Updated:

@REP

there are multiple view points in the story.

Most authors on SOL don't understand POV. I think a mult-POV tag would be misused more than 2nd-POV is.

Replies: REP

REP 🚫

@Switch Blayde

Most authors on SOL don't understand POV

That is probably true. A new code could be defined as: Multiple View Points - The story is told by multiple characters.

That may help by not using the term POV.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@REP

A new code could be defined as: Multiple View Points - The story is told by multiple characters.

What about this story. Is the story told from multiple POVs (Joe's and Sue's) and deserving of the proposed code?

Joe stared across the room at Sue. He had loved her since fifth grade. He wondered if she would dance with him. He'd give his left nut for a single dance.

Sue tried not to look at Joe. Why was he even at the party? He was a creep. Everyone hated him. She prayed he didn't come near her.

What if the story is in 3rd-person omniscient POV? There is only one POV, that of the omni narrator.

Replies: REP

REP 🚫

@Switch Blayde

What about this story.

If you mean Aroslav's story, he said he used 1st and 3rd person narratives in his story.

He also said:

I believe that people who actually use the codes on SOL to determine what kind of story it is and whether they want to read it, primarily view the 2nd POV code as meaning from more than one perspective.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@REP

primarily view the 2nd POV code as meaning from more than one perspective.

That would explain the misuse of the code. Good to know.

Ernest Bywater 🚫

@REP

He believes many readers interpret that to mean the story is told from multiple points of view, so he assigns that code.

That all depends on how you interpret multiple point of view.

If I saw a story tagged as multiple points of view I would expect some parts to be first person POV and other parts to be third person POV.

The POV classification is related to the type or style of point of view used, not how many character's point of view are involved.

What might be best it to give a more detailed description of what 2nd POV means so all understand it better.

Replies: Keet REP

Keet 🚫
Updated:

@Ernest Bywater

That all depends on how you interpret multiple point of view.

If I saw a story tagged as multiple points of view I would expect some parts to be first person POV and other parts to be third person POV.

As a reader I would interpret that tag as "told from by characters" as in some stories where the chapters switch between two or more characters that tell the story. Most readers have no idea what the different POV's are.
ETA: I saw your post after what I quoted. Exactly that: switching first POV between different characters.

Replies: REP

REP 🚫

@Keet

As a reader I would interpret that tag as

How would you view the tag 'Multiple View Points'. Perhaps 'Multiple Perspectives' would be a better code.

Replies: Switch Blayde Keet

Switch Blayde 🚫

@REP

Perhaps 'Multiple Perspectives' would be a better code.

Since there's so much head-hopping present in SOL stories, just about every story would have that code. LOL

Replies: REP

REP 🚫
Updated:

@Switch Blayde

so much head-hopping present

Now I always thought head-hopping was done from a single perspective. :)

Of course you can also have multiple character describing things and they are all head-hopping.

Keet 🚫

@REP

How would you view the tag 'Multiple View Points'. Perhaps 'Multiple Perspectives' would be a better code.

Both would seem to me as multiple characters narrating part of the story. You must realize that most non-author readers have no idea what a 'POV' is. They most likely see a story as "told by the main character" or "told by someone else". Most readers just read and see how the story is told to them. So they might like a first person POV but they translate that as "the MC tells the story as he experiences it".

REP 🚫

@Ernest Bywater

What might be best it to give a more detailed description of what 2nd POV means

Yes that would be good and I assume you are referring to providing that description in Lazeez's code definition.

If you read my suggested definition for Multiple View Points, I deliberately omitted POV and said told by multiple characters.

Replies: Ernest Bywater

Ernest Bywater 🚫

@REP

told by multiple characters.

It's that interpretation which I covered in my second post as it's only relevant when using the first person POV and can be safely done anyway.

Ernest Bywater 🚫

Come to think of it, the only time it would be valid to state you use the point of view of multiple characters would be when using the first person point of view and you switch characters between chapters. If you do that a lot then a comment in the story description may be more relevant, or a note at the start of the story.

hiltonls16 🚫

I have read a lot and written nothing.

It seems to me that any scene written in the second person must be from third person point of view. How else can it be in the form 'you went to the shop' or 'you thought that looks good'.

Are there any examples of stories (or scenes) written in the second person?

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@hiltonls16

'you went to the shop' or 'you thought that looks good'.

That's exactly what 2nd-POV is.

It's used in games like Dungeons & Dragons. "You find an axe."

It's used in how-to manuals. "You put A into slot B."

It's used sometimes in short stories. It's rarely used in novels, but it has been.

The reader is the main character in the story.

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

If you guys (authors) can't seem to know or agree on what 2nd POV or multi-POV is, I don't think it would bring any benefits to add more tags about POV.

Replies: Ernest Bywater REP

Ernest Bywater 🚫

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

If you guys (authors) can't seem to know or agree on what 2nd POV or multi-POV is, I don't think it would bring any benefits to add more tags about POV.

I second that emotion.

REP 🚫
Updated:

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

The problem is POV is a term used to mean 2 things:

1. The manner in which the narrative is written.

2. The character who is providing the narrative.

The 2nd POV code should only be used with #1.

There is no code for #2. That is my suggested code.

Aroslav and possibly other authors use 2nd POV for reason #2.

I don't have a problem is you don't feel the code is needed. However, there are currently 152 stories coded as 2nd POV, and the majority, if not all, are written using the 1st or 3rd person POV.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@REP

2. The character who is providing the narrative.

Except that would be "2 POVs" not "2nd-POV"

Replies: REP

REP 🚫

@Switch Blayde

Except that would be "2 POVs" not "2nd-POV"

I never said #2 was 2nd POV.

When people refer to a character's viewpoint they typically say "his or her Point of View". That type of POV is not the same as 2nd POV.

Multiple View Points or Multiple Perspective would be the viewpoints of 2 or more characters.

awnlee jawking 🚫

@REP

Aroslav also has another story with the 2nd-POV tag. It's actually a curious mixture of 1st and 2nd, so IMO he used the tag correctly in that instance.

AJ

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫
Updated:

@awnlee jawking

It's actually a curious mixture of 1st and 2nd

That's used more with roleplaying than a short story. When you chat with someone and say:

You walk into my bedroom.
I smile at your nudity.
You…

Replies: awnlee jawking

awnlee jawking 🚫

@Switch Blayde

That's exactly the style Aroslav used!

AJ

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫
Updated:

@awnlee jawking

That's exactly the style Aroslav used!

That's mixing 1st- and 2nd-pov. To make that 2nd-pov, you'd write:

You walk into Joe's bedroom. He smiles at your nudity. You…

ETA:

Okay, so why isn't that mixing 1st- and 3rd-pov?

Because in the first one, there are two different POV characters (the "you" and the "I"). In the second one, Joe is not a POV character.

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2nd POV code

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