Forum: Author Hangout

Further, articles like the one you cited are often placed to condition the publics ideas about what is acceptable. With heating oil prices way up I expect some poor people could freeze to death under what would be considered normal winter conditions. If the general public have been conditioned to expect snowmageddon then such deaths will not have a political backlash. If there are no deaths then it will be forgotten in the 24 hour spin cycle.
Another example. Last week the German government was stating that food prices should be high so that the people will appreciate their food more. This comes after reports that there is no fertilizer for next years crops.

Keeping things on topic for SOL. IIRC Jay Cantrell quit his job as a newspaper editor after 9/11 when he was told to publish articles that were part of the 'drum beat for war' at the time. Such manipulations have always happened. I once looked at scans of international newspapers from 1936 to get an idea of wages & prices at the time. What fascinated me was the Australian press was running articles preparing the country to accept war with Japan while at the same time the British press was preparing the country for war with Germany. Three years before WWII started and five before Japan entered the conflict.
Similar stories about possible conflict with China have been run for the last twelve months.

If you look at what the Japanese and the Nazis were up to at the time, it was looking very likely that the fit was about to hit the shan.

The Japanese invaded Manchuria in 1931, allied themselves with Germany in 1936 and invaded China in late 1937. They were clearly empire-building, and their resources were a lot better than the ones ISIS had. Look up "Nanjing Massacre" some time.

Nazi Germany scaled their propaganda back in the 1930's because they very much wanted the 1936 Olympic Games to be a success, then they cut loose again. Their stated aims were to kill the Jews, repudiate the borders imposed after WW1 and kill the Bolsheviks (surprise!, although they reverted to type in 1941). That was all laid out in Mein Kampf which was published in the mid 1920's. From what I have read over the years, Hitler already loathed Jews back in his time in the WW1 trenches.
There is a story here which attempts to recreate the atmosphere in The Reich shortly before WW2 - https://storiesonline.net/s/21675/coming-to-nuremberg by Douglas Fox. The author has forgotten most of the German he ever spoke, but the content is broadly in line with other sources from the time.

Saying that "the British press was preparing the country for war with Germany" is over-simplifying things though, the Daily Mail was quite appreciative of the Nazis until war actually broke out.

We'll have to agree to disagree. From my reading of the times the decision to go to war had already been made.

Germany invading the East had zero impact on the safety of Britain and China being invaded had zero impact on the safety of Australia.
Two of the largest powers in Europe grinding their youth to hamburger while Britain traded with both would have left Britain in a commanding position.
But rearmament was getting underway and the first stories creating the idea of a threat to the homeland were being placed in the press. Forcing the abdication of the king that year was part of that process.

It's obvious that the "news" is managed by some kind of "central committee".

That would sound like a conspiracy theory a few years ago.
Since then John McLaughlin, former Deputy Director and Acting Director of the CIA made his infamous comment "Thank God for the deep state."

The deep state would likely be that committee.

A chest freezer will keep food frozen longer than an upright, three to five days if full, versus three days for an upright.

If your freezer breaks or you are without power AND the outside ambient temperature is below freezing, no problem. Almost any unheated outhouse will work, just bag it all whilst still frozen and store it out there.

Avoid outhouses that have an ambient temp at or above freezing.

Part fill with water a plastic drink bottle that has concave sides, allow it to freeze the place upside down with the stored food. If the temp rises above freezing some or all of the ice will melt and drip to the bottom. No drips, all is good when uncovered and placed in a working freezer.

No outbuilding? Stack on snow in shaded spot and cover with snow, at least 18". Use bottle trick, also use wire mesh etc to ensure no animal access.

If your freezer breaks or you are without power AND the outside ambient temperature is below freezing, no problem. Almost any unheated outhouse will work, just bag it all whilst still frozen and store it out there.

For an upright freezer, in freezing weather with no power: Get some empty gallon jugs (milk, water, watever) fill them with water. Put them out side to freeze. When frozen stick two in the freezer and one in the fridge. When they melt, put them back outside and bring fresh frozen jugs in.

This eliminates the issue of having to protect food stored outdoors from animals.

What did people do before electric refrigeration? Icebox

ETA: Heating your living space in such conditions is going to be much more critical. Most high efficiency gas furnaces these days use electric ignition, not a pilot light. No power, no heat.

Put them out side to freeze. When frozen stick two in the freezer and one in the fridge.

That presupposes that the room the freezer room isn't one you are trying to keep warm. Otherwise sure.

That presupposes that the room the freezer room isn't one you are trying to keep warm. Otherwise sure.

Modern refrigerators are well insulated. Does a running fridge/freezer interfere with keeping your kitchen warm? No. So why do you imagine that putting ice in your fridge/freezer during a power outage to keep your food cold would do so?

ETA: Heating your living space in such conditions is going to be much more critical. Most high efficiency gas furnaces these days use electric ignition, not a pilot light. No power, no heat.

An electronic space heater and a Honda generator fixes that problem.
Though thinking ahead, you wouldn't even need the generation system (panels or generator) if you just installed the power storage system.
The latter can charge from the grid when it's up.

That comment says more about you than it does about how things actually are. You are also relying on second-hand information relayed by organisations with an agenda.

A reporter standing in front of a camera talking about peaceful protestors while said 'protestors' are looting stores and burning buildings further down the street behind him.

Saw that one myself.
They are telling us it's raining while pissing on our legs.

You are also relying on second-hand information relayed by organisations with an agenda.

No he's not, I've personally witnessed what he's talking about.

Those 'mostly peaceful protestors' with the burning buidings in the background was, I think, one of the crowning points of showing their perfidy.

It was a Baghdad Bob moment.

For those who don't remember: Sadam's spokesman was in front of the cameras bragging about how Iraq was winning the war against the US and a US M1 Abrams tank rolls by in the background. :)

Ernest Bywater
1/29/2022, 1:16:13 PM

@Remus2

There used to be an organization group known as 'news media' but it has been replaced with the liberal woke party propaganda machine and their agenda is to totally disrupt and destroy the US as a culture and a nation.

If you are so convinced that it's all propaganda, why do you watch?

Burying your head in the sand won't stop the idiots, so it's better to keep an eye on them.

There used to be an organization group known as 'news media' but it has been replaced with the liberal woke party propaganda machine and their agenda is to totally disrupt and destroy the US as a culture and a nation.

To the extent that I'm that cynical (and I am, from time to time), I'd say that the vast majority of the 'news media' on the US is very, very, VERY corporate and its agenda is to keep the US population squabbling with each other while major corporations and the rich continue to profit far more than the average person.

The single strongest media organization in the US is Fox News, and it's hardly in support of the 'liberal woke party'. What we have are, in essence, two news silos. You can pick left-leaning (from slightly left to very, very left) or right-leaning (from moderately right to incredibly far right). There's very little in the middle. People can compensate to some extent by averaging the two sides, but since they can't even agree on what the facts are, that often doesn't work.

Neither the Murdochs nor Jeff Bezos nor the Sulzbergers nor AT&T (WarnerMedia) nor Comcast nor General Electric are interested in 'disrupting and destroying the US as a culture and a nation', except to the extent that they want to destroy the ability of the average person to resist corporate power. All of them are highly invested in the US remaining the dominant world power (including the Murdochs, even though they're not Americans for the most part) - they just want the US to follow the lead of the rich and powerful.

The more that people who are generally in the middle, and who disagree to a moderate extent over policy but would tend - on their own - to compromise and move on, are polarized and believe that 'compromise' is a dirty word, that the other side are evil and 'the enemy', that it's 'woke liberals' vs 'fascist Nazi theocrats', that one or the other side is attempting to 'destroy the US', instead of what I see as reality - slightly left-leaning centrists vs slightly right-leaning centrists - the more we're busily infighting, the less we're focused on the people who're profiting by far the most from the current system.

Really annoying when doing my own research to find out that all of those 'wacky conspiracy theories' regarding the Rothschild, Rockefeller, and Bilderberg families are neither 'wacky' nor 'theories' but they're for damned sure conspiracies.

I came to the same conclusion after researching them. The hardest part of that is putting yourself in the mindframe necessary to understand why any person or group would do such a thing.

The era those conspiracies came into being was a different world, with attitudes and mindsets that are an anathema to the minds of today. Which in large parts is why they are considered as "wacky conspiracy theories" today.

I don't care about food, I care about my vast collection of decapitated human heads that I have amassed over the years.

Freezing them is not the best long term preservation strategy. Have you never heard of freezer burn?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28275269/

Have you looked up the terms-of-service of the power companies? Could you not sue them and oblige them to replace the losses incurred due to their incompetence?

@Dominions Son

Freezing them is not the best long term preservation strategy.

What method do you use? ;-)

The scientific/medical community has used formalin for the long term preservation of biological samples for a very long time.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28275269/

Or you could use plastination.

Or you could use plastination.

https://bodyworlds.com/

I don't care about food, I care about my vast collection of decapitated human heads that I have amassed over the years. That's years of work lost right there. If they defrost, they'll go all squishy and their eyeballs will fall out. And once you push them back in, they are just never the same. :(

I'm just wondering...

Have you perchance misinterpreted the idiom, "cooler heads will prevail"?

:)

I love the Forum! Where else could you find a thread that goes from exaggeration in the media to the decapitation and preservation of human heads?

Pravda means 'Truth' and Izvestia means 'News'. In Russia, the joke is that there is no Izvestia in Pravda and no Pravda in Izvestia ...
"

Said mostly in Soviet satellite states.

I was never behind the wall during the Soviet era, so I have no idea regarding that. I have been there four times since, and never heard it in western Russia, nor in the Ural mountains Siberia.
Poland, Latvia, Georgia, and Ukraine, heard it in all four, so I assumed it was more common in the Satellite states.

So help me Bob.

In the UK I doubt there'd be a blizzard cold enough to match the temperature inside a working freezer.

True (the recommended temp in the US for a residential freezer is 0F/-18C) and you generally don't get snow, much less blizzards at those temps.

However, in an extended power outage, keeping your frozen foods below freezing (32F/0C) is better than nothing.

To get back to the original topic ~

What percentage of the public would even think to put frozen food outside in a blizzard?

I suspect it's well under 25%. The rest would just sit there complaining and let the food rot.

Might not be your freezer idea but I do know a few people who couldn't cook food during a power outage as their stove and microwave didn't work and complained about eating cold Cambells soup yet never touched or used there working grill that sat in the backyard. I mean who actually cooks on an open flame ......

Might not be your freezer idea but I do know a few people who couldn't cook food during a power outage as their stove and microwave didn't work and complained about eating cold Cambells soup yet never touched or used there working grill that sat in the backyard.

The upside to an apocalypse. Idiots won't survive long enough to breed more like them, or worse.

but I do know a few people who couldn't cook food during a power outage

That's the nice thing about a gas stove. If the power is out, the electric ignition might not work, but you can always light the burners with a match if necessary.

I mean who actually cooks on an open flame

Lots of people. Gas ranges and/or ovens are still more common than electric in some parts of the US.

Sarcasm

Lots of people. Gas ranges and/or ovens are still more common than electric in some parts of the US.

That will not last for places like New York are making it so that new construction and modern upgrades can only legally have electric. Because this will save the environment. When this goes into full effect I just can't wait for them to explain when the power fails in winter.

The odd thing is, those same people are pushing to have all coal fired boilers for generation to be converted to natural gas.
Before 2024, I predict it will reach critical mass, with a subsequent massive power outage in the Northeast, and likely the west coast. Those electric devices don't work for shit without electricity.

Yes I agree and if you can recall thursday August 14, 2003 just a small power outage caused by tree limbs touching power lines and a software bug in the alarm system failing. Cutting power off to Ontario in Central Canada, and the States of New York, New Jersey, Maryland, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania with loss of power lasting in areas from a few hours to 4 days.

In my area alone just this past summer we had a 2 tornado event that knocked out power for 9 days for me and 15 days till full restoration.

Lucky that these happened in the summer time because if it happens in winter then people would really be screwed heck this week alone we are averaging 20F ( -6.6C ) and for 3 nights the high was -7F ( -21.6C )

https://www.nerc.com/pa/rrm/ea/Pages/Blackout-August-2003.aspx

According to reports found there, several utilities fucked up by the numbers. Especially due to inadequate vegetation management.

The tree problem wasn't the only cause though.

Bad thing is, the same problem hit the West Coast later. The lack of vegetation management was part of the cause for the fires in California.

Specifically the Camp fire.

The politicos are too busy screaming and pointing fingers when they should bite the bullet and push back on the people who don't want them to clear the right aways.
At this point, it's not if, it's when.

Specifically the Camp fire.

The politicos are too busy screaming and pointing fingers when they should bite the bullet and push back on the people who don't want them to clear the right aways.

In California, the politicos actively get in the way of that happening.

https://www.hunker.com/12003648/oak-tree-removal-laws-in-california

We'll see what excuses they use when their constituents are next in the dark.

That scenario can easily play out in the N.E. as well. It's been sufficient time for the out of sight out of mind memory collapse to occur.

DTP author Peter Grant wrote of a couple who turned up in his yard, driving their RV after Katrina. Gourmets, they evacuated with all their cookwear, no canned food and no cash. Electronic transactions were out in a tri state region and they expected their debit cards and Whole Foods deliveries to be working.
In a true apocalypse people like that are going to be Soylent Green.

What percentage of the public would even think to put frozen food outside in a blizzard?

Who said it had to be a blizzard? What was the headline the OP was talking about, again? Oh, yeah ...

When the power goes out due to severe weather, do you know how long your food will remain fresh in the fridge and freezer

Severe weather could be anything from, yes, a blizzard, to an ice storm to a tornado or hurricane. What about in THOSE situations, where the weather outside is NOT cold enough?

October 26-29, 2020 - Oklahoma ice storm - the link has pictures of some of what happened. Basically, most of the Oklahoma City metro area lost power due to freezing rain putting too much weight in ice on trees and power lines. On my own house, the weight of ice on the line quite literally ripped the pipe going up from the meter base off the house - as well as the meter. (We don't have underground utilities in our neighborhood - and that didn't necessarily help those neighborhoods that did, because the lines that brought the power IN to those neighborhoods got wiped out.)

So, holy crap, it's freezing! And then it warmed back up into the 40's and 50's. It was a solid week before we got power restored. We took some stuff from our freezer over to a relative's house that didn't lose power, but they didn't have room for everything. Nothing else we COULD do but watch it be ruined. If we couldn't cook it on the gas stovetop, it went bad.

This is the second severe ice storm I've been through - we had one hit Indiana when I lived in Lafayette, and some of the rural communities up there didn't get power restored for a full MONTH. That one took down some of the BIG towers, and even closed I-65 for a while because having the big high tension lines just laying on the ground is a BAD thing.

Severe weather could be anything from, yes, a blizzard, to an ice storm to a tornado or hurricane. What about in THOSE situations, where the weather outside is NOT cold enough?

Is there somewhere in your area you can get dry ice?

Pack a cooler with frozen food and dry ice.

The local Super WalMart was open because they have their own generators, but even the Waffle House in their parking lot was closed.

It's damn near the apocalypse when the awful waffle closes in the South, and Southeast.

People were having fun simply trying to get gas, because gas stations didn't have power for THEIR pumps, either.

Ironically, due to the design of their pumps, thirty or forty years ago a gas station might have been able to sell gas for cash even during a power outage. It would have taken some work by a station employee, but it could be done.

There's not much you can do when every road is covered in ice and snow and the city has one salt truck ...

You know the roads are bad when the ice and packed snow covering the roads stats to develop it's own pot holes. :)

Where I live, H-E-B are the champions are disaster recover. Walmart manages, but H-E-B consistently does amazing things when someplace gets hit (or when every place gets hit, like last year). A while back they invested in generators for every store, with fuel supplies for a serious outage.

What/Who is H-E-B? Please.

A Texas supermarket chain.

What/Who is H-E-B? Please.

In the context of Grey Wolf's post a supermarket chain that started in Texas.

Granted, that also collective acronym of the cities of Hurst, Euless, and Bedford located in Tarrant county near the Dallas-Fort Worth airport in the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex. The acronym also is used by the school district that encompasses those cities.

What/Who is H-E-B? Please.

In the context of Grey Wolf's post a supermarket chain that started in Texas.

Granted, that also collective acronym of the cities of Hurst, Euless, and Bedford located in Tarrant county near the Dallas-Fort Worth airport in the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex. The acronym also is used by the school district that encompasses those cities.

What percentage of the public would even think to put frozen food outside in a blizzard?

The last one I found myself in, tells me, 25% is being extremely optimistic.
There was a foot of snow out, and we get a knock on the door. It was the woman in the apartment next door. She was bawling and carrying on about her refrigerator going down ruining the milk she had for her baby. I walked back to her place to assess the problem, and find her worthless boyfriend smoking dope.
She had a balcony like everyone else that was covered in snow. The waste of food, started bragging about being smart enough to have gotten a kerosene heater. I then point out the snow on the deck and say it's cold enough for everything in their fridge to which this Darwin reject says "but that would let out the heat."
So he would let their baby go hungry so his worthless ass would stay warm?
I went back dug out some condensed milk cans and gave them to her with instructions how to reconstitute them.
Two days later, when the cops could get out and about, they were there to throw his dumb ass out. He'd apparently beaten her for going to get help.

Darwin should have just haunted some apartment buildings for his study rather than trapsing off to South America.

That's probably how conspiracy theories get started...

That's probably how conspiracy theories get started...

Nope, all conspiracy theories are started by the US CIA.

/meta conspiracy theory

:)

However it does allow nasties like salmonella to grow at a faster rate.

Only if the temperature rises above a certain point.

Dead wrong.
Those nasties grow very, very slowly even in deep frost conditions. I worked for a customer who produced ice-cream.
For some of it they used yoghurt cultures which they stored below -40°. I asked why so cold and they told me to avoid spoilage.
As a rule of thumb nasties like bacteria, mold, yeast double their growth rate with each degree Celsius increase.
(Until they reach their optimal temperature, above it they grow slower and finally die.)

BTW, I deliberately omitted the C or F for -40°, because it's the same for both.

HM.

-40°, because it's the same for both.

Or, go with 233.15 K. It makes it sound MUCH worse when you say it was 305 outside today, than 90 F or 32 C.