What genre is a story that takes place in 1882 in the Old West considered, a Western or Historical Fiction? It's not one of those cowboys and Indians or cattlemen vs sheepherders or gunfighter type stories. It simply takes place in the Old West.
What genre is a story that takes place in 1882 in the Old West considered, a Western or Historical Fiction? It's not one of those cowboys and Indians or cattlemen vs sheepherders or gunfighter type stories. It simply takes place in the Old West.
from
https://storiesonline.net/docs/code_faq.php
Western - Set in the old US west
Historical - Story that is set in past history, mostly related to famous people and events.
I seem to remember Lazeez once saying Historical is more like 16th century and before. However, the story you suggest clearly falls in the Western genre.
typo to minimise thread drift.
I seem to remember Lazeez once saying Historical is more like 16th century and before. However, it clearly falls in the Western genre.
Oh, then what would you call something set in 17th century London?
There is a fair bit of overlap in some genres.
What's the plot?
Is it a romance? In that case, I'd call it a historical romance (a genre in it's own right separate from more general historical fiction).
Is it a romance? In that case, I'd call it a historical romance (a genre in it's own right
It's the sub-genre I'm looking for. It's Erotica-something.
It's romance and LGBT (well, Hetero and LB which is the conflict that makes up the plot).
So maybe it's Erotica-Romance regardless of the time period.
So maybe it's Erotica-Romance regardless of the time period.
Historical Romantic Erotica or Western Erotica (which also includes ANY pornographic photos of women in the cowgirl position!)?
Western Erotica (which also includes ANY pornographic photos of women in the cowgirl position!)
Regular cowgirl or reverse cowgirl?
Western Erotica (which also includes ANY pornographic photos of women in the cowgirl position!)
Regular cowgirl or reverse cowgirl?
Girl sitting astride a prone man.
Girl sitting astride a prone man.
I know what the cowgirl position is. Regular she faces is head, reverse, she faces his feet.
Didn't you ask this very question not long ago?
I may have. My memory is crap. And since I'm nearing publishing, it came up again.
Someone on wattpad said that if I was planning on traditionally publishing not to call it a Western. She said Western is a dead genre. So that's a good reason not to classify it as a Western.
Also, Westerns are modeled after the dime novels from the late 1800s. Authors like Zane Grey. Where they romanticized the Cowboy and Indian wars and gunfighters. Articles I read called stories like Lonesome Dove and The Reverent Historical Fiction, not Westerns.
I did some research since posting this question (this time). One interesting article asked the question of whether "The Great Gatsby" was Historical Fiction. Historical fiction is typically when the setting is 50 years ago or longer. But the woman raised the question: 50 years to who, the author or the reader. The novel was written in 1925 which is when the story takes place. Other definitions for it to be Historical Fiction state that research has to be done. Fitzgerald didn't have to do research. He was living in that period. I thought that was interesting.
Another rule for it being Historical Fiction that many used and pertained to the author doing research is that some events and/or characters in the story were real in that time period. Although I researched things like clothing and outhouses, all characters are fictitious and there are no real events, other than a reference to the Irish land wars at that time.
I think it's going to end up being Erotica Romance (it just happens to take place in the Old West in 1882).
Articles I read called stories like Lonesome Dove and The Reverent Historical Fiction
Lonsesome Dove (the book) was published as a Western, and based on the plot I would agree.
As for the other one, if it's what I'm thinking of it's The Revenant not The Reverent. I haven't seen the movie or read the book, but what I understand of it, it's more a mountain man thing than a cowboy thing, so not a Western even if Western's weren't dead.
I did some research since posting this question (this time). One interesting article asked the question of whether "The Great Gatsby" was Historical Fiction. Historical fiction is typically when the setting is 50 years ago or longer. But the woman raised the question: 50 years to who, the author or the reader. The novel was written in 1925 which is when the story takes place.
This raises the question of what you mean by Historical Fiction. Do you mean a genre of fiction or something more descriptive.
The Great Gatsby was written more than 50 years ago, and it's kind of historically significant in terms of American Culture. So it could be called historical fiction in a descriptive sense even if it doesn't fall in the genre of Historical Fiction.
This raises the question of what you mean by Historical Fiction. Do you mean a genre of fiction or something more descriptive.
The Great Gatsby was written more than 50 years ago, and it's kind of historically significant in terms of American Culture. So it could be called historical fiction in a descriptive sense even if it doesn't fall in the genre of Historical Fiction.
While various stories may be historically relevant, "Historical Fiction", like "Historical Romance" are very specific publishing genres, so it's best to check with the publishing sources, to see how they specifically define the terms.
Just like with Romance stories, publishers will only publish works that fit into specific themes, or stick to specific 'types' (ex: you can't tell the story from a male POV).
it's best to check with the publishing sources, to see how they specifically define the terms.
When I researched it, I learned there is no agreed upon definition of Historical Fiction.
Just like with Romance stories, publishers will only publish works that fit into specific themes, or stick to specific 'types
Which is one reason I gave up on traditional publishing.
Which is one reason I gave up on traditional publishing.
Then go with "Western", adding a tag line of "an Alternative Western". But, from what you've intimated, it sounds like it better fits under "Historical Fiction".
But, don't forget, you can specify several differing Genres when publishing, as well as adding various alternate search key tags, so your book will pop whenever someone searches for the specific keyword.
But, don't forget, you can specify several differing Genres when publishing,
I believe a genre and a sub-genre under that genre that you choose from a list. The primary will be erotica. I'll see what the sub-genres under that are. Putting "western" as a tag is a good idea.
Hey, if Americans changed "theatre" to "theater" how come we don't spell "genre" "gener"? (rhetorical)
Hey, if Americans changed "theatre" to "theater" how come we don't spell "genre" "gener"? (rhetorical)
Actually, there probably is an answer. Has to do with who/what language we got the word from.
But the woman raised the question: 50 years to who, the author or the reader.
Sounds like a valid point to me. If the genre is assigned at the time of writing/release and cannot be changed, then it cannot be defined as 'Historical". However if the genre can be changed at some point in the future, then 'Historical' would be valid.
I personally would use the genre assigned at the time of writing/release.
Also, Westerns are modeled after the dime novels from the late 1800s. Authors like Zane Grey. Where they romanticized the Cowboy and Indian wars and gunfighters. Articles I read called stories like Lonesome Dove and The Reverent Historical Fiction, not Westerns.
They make a good point. The traditional Westerns isn't merely dead, it was put down long ago with terminal malice! Which is why it's best to put the era's 'assumptions' in context, rather than simply retreading the same insulting assertions. It's difficult for modern readers to relate to date historical works WITHOUT a LOT of background putting everything in context.
No genre is dead until it no longer has any readers.
https://storiesonline.net/s/18824/the-legend-of-eli-crow
That story comes to mind as well as several others here and in DTP.
That story comes to mind as well as several others here and in DTP.
Though, that story falls into the 'Cultural Approximation' category, as it's a White man describing a story OF a Native America, to OTHER White men, rather than someone telling their own culture's stories, through their own lens.
At this point, I'm wondering whether Dick Wolf has a career left, or whether he can pull another rabbit out of his hat without using his usual cultural tropes. I've always loved his shows, but their assumptions have always deeply troubled me.
It's a story about a half-breed Cherokee of which I am one. If it's 'Cultural Approximation' as you say, he did a damn good job of the 'approximation' regarding white folks reaction to half-breeds among other things.
It's a story about a half-breed Cherokee of which I am one. If it's 'Cultural Approximation' as you say, he did a damn good job of the 'approximation' regarding white folks reaction to half-breeds among other things.
I'll agree, it was an excellent book (even though it's been a LONG time since I last read it). I was just pointing out how 'Westerns' and NOW viewed, and how it's permanently altered the popularity of the genre.
The traditional Westerns isn't merely dead, it was put down long ago with terminal malice!
One article I read (probably the same one with the quote about Zane Grey) said most Westerns today are written by Native Americans and are more about their culture and stuff.
Didn't you ask this very question not long ago?
btw, what did we decide the last time?
btw, what did we decide the last time?
I can't find the thread:(
IIRC you've been working on this novel for a while, so it may not be terribly recent.
As to the conclusions, since it's probably the same people responding, I'm sure they'll be completely different.
Or perhaps I'm hallucinating because of the heatwave we Brits are experiencing.
AJ
btw, what did we decide the last time?
In one thread you raised the question of genre or code definition, and that may be what was being referenced about a prior discussion. It's the only one I could find so far.
https://storiesonline.net/d/s9/t6103/old-west-stories#po109395
In one thread you raised the question of genre or code definition,
Aha. Back then it was supposed to be a short story to post on SOL. So I was asking about SOL fields — the genre vs the story code. If I remember correctly (and that's a big if), I was considering a genre of "erotica" with the "western" story code.
But I really got into the story and it grew and grew. Many more characters and sub-plots, things you don't do with a short story. The "short story" is now almost 102,000 words so it's obviously not a short story and I'm looking at industry definitions for genre.
Depends on what you think the appeal might be.
If your aiming for a historical-fiction audience, call it historical
In 1877, the last tribe to try to escape from an Indian reservation was was eradicated.
in 1877, the labor unrest included armed battles near Denver.
The firs story would be a western; the second would not.]
In 1877, the last tribe to try to escape from an Indian reservation was was eradicated.
in 1877, the labor unrest included armed battles near Denver.
Then it's not a Western. Good example.