Forum: Author Hangout

Here's a link showing how to use those tools.
http://www.well-storied.com/blog/scriveners-writing-tools

Thanks.
Two clicks after a highlight is certainly much easier than Copy, open browser, Paste, then click on Search.
I doubt there's anything else which treats access to a thesaurus as so important it's the default option needing the least number of clicks.
As I recall when I last looked into writing software - back in the days I maintained the delusion I may someday write a multi-chapter story - Scrivener was the best product keeping plans and drafts of different chapters separate but easily accessible.

Is the USD$40 a one-off payment or annual subscription fee?

Is the USD$40 a one-off payment

One time payment. You can get a free trial for something like 30 days

And it's 30 days of USE,

I believe it's 30 different times you can open the program. So open it and don't shut it down for a month or two.

Open Office has a thesaurus, I don't remember if it's standard, part of the language pack for the spell checker or a separate add-on.

THANKS!

I have OpenOffice installed with no added features.
When I looked it up, highlighting a word then Cntl+F7 gives you a list of alternatives from the thesaurus.

YEAH! :-)

Thanks to all, but I'm done now.

Thesauruses are great tools for people who are very familiar with the English language. People who are not native English speakers ... [used] word selections [that] made them look bad.

I don't think the danger is limited to non-native speakers. Anyone who thinks their thesaurus is a panacea for dull writing will probably become a bad writer. But, it's hard to imagine how an author could be harmed by overusing their dictionary.
I think authors should be aware that they have different levels of "knowing" various words. In broad terms this range includes:
(a) Words they know fully (including what distinguishes them from other words with similar meanings) and they are inclined to select themselves when speaking or writing
(b) Words they know fully but might not think to use unless seeing it in a thesaurus, etc. jogs them to consider it
(c) Words they know well enough to understand fully when used in their correct context by others, but if asked about the word without context, you could not describe its nuances compared to words with similar meanings.
(d) Words you don't really know, but you can get the gist of a sentence well enough when others use them.

I find a thesaurus very useful for reminding of some (b) words when my first word choice seems a bit dull or I am hoping to find a word that means precisely what I want.
I not only use dictionaries before writing words myself to check my understanding of their precise nuances is correct, but also when reading things written by writers I respect. Since starting to write I've begun looking up words much more often when I don't see why an author chose one word instead of the one which naturally occurs to me. Over time, a lot of words have moved from my (b) and (c) vocabularies up into my (a).
Also, thesauruses are great when you want to find a suitable alliterative word to use. There's nothing like a string of alliteration to enhance your efforts at scathing sarcasm! Eh? You know who :-)
I had great fun recently finding just the right words to describe CMOS. 'Demented' was an obvious choice for their recommendation that a dash, not hyphen, is needed in 'Chuck Berry--style'. 'Despicable despots' came easily enough. That's literally true, it's a given here, and they're good $10 alliterative words. Now I wanted a collective noun, e.g. a flock of birds, a pride of lions, a proud of pedants, an autocracy of authors). I needed something beginning 'de-'. A 'demonate of lawyers' seemed too obvious but I eventually found 'debacle'. So, CMOS is a 'demented debacle of despicable despots'. A very precisely accurate description that works for me.

I not only use dictionaries before writing words myself to check my understanding of their precise nuances is correct

This is my normal mode. I have a very good vocabulary and assiduously avoid the repetition of words. Many of those words, such as 'assiduously', aren't ones I use in normal conversation but while I'm writing pop into my head from my internal thesaurus. If I'm not perfectly certain I'll then look it up to make sure if fits the sentence I'm writing. (and 'assiduously' did fit perfectly)

and 'assiduously' did fit perfectly

"Made you look! Ha. Ha," he gloated.
Well done. I now know its nuance beyond accuracy is the care and effort to achieve that accuracy. :-)

But yet I had to look up the definition of participles and irregular verbs.

It reminds me of reading music. Give me sheet music and play a starting note and I can go from there. However, 'Key of G' means nothing to me. I have no comprehension of what that's supposed to sound like.

I can write sentences, better than most people, that correctly use verb forms. I can tell you whether it's describing past, present or continuing action. At the same time I did not know what made a verb irregular, what a participle was, or why some forms are considered perfect. Somehow those labels never caught hold in my brain back in ninth grade.

I had to look up the definition of participles and irregular verbs.

It's nice to know someone is reading my lengthy posts explaining points of grammar.

The strange thing is most of those who study grammar and writing seem appallingly bad at explaining it to ordinary people. CMOS is the worst I've ever seen, but it is the only thing I've found that attempts to cover all the relevant points.

I think my ability as a computer programmer allows me to identify the central elements and patterns, but I tend to write explanations like design specifications for programs, and the trees can get lost in the forest of undergrowth when I list the exceptions.

It's nice to know someone is reading my lengthy posts explaining points of grammar.

You doubted?

an assidousy of asses!

OUCH!
I disqualify that one on the grounds it's not a collective noun, but singular. Nobody works as hard and carefully as I at being an ass. :-)

Speaking of asses, Scaramucci lasted a whole 10 days.

He was embarrassing to Trump

but the day after Spicer lost his job

Spicer actually hasn't left yet. He was scheduled to do so on Aug 30 and reports are he may now stay.

Don't give Trump any ideas. He is likely to write an Executive Order abolishing the two term limit. :)

EO's were only allowed to be used to change existing law when O was president.

EO's were only allowed to be used to change existing law when O was president.

Gasp! Splutter! Vomit! Junior regularly signed into law bills Congress had passed and then signed a memorandum stating which parts of those laws his administration had manufactured an interpretation to justify his intention of pretending they don't exist in the law.
The Constitution does not allow Presidents a line-by-line veto of laws Congress passed, but if it exists in practice now it's because he made it so routine.

The Constitution does not allow Presidents a line-by-line veto of laws Congress passed, but if it exists in practice now it's because he made it so routine.

I'll agree with this.

There are things they've been doing for so long that even if it doesn't appear in law the Court just throws up it's hands and says, "Chevron deference."

assidousy

I'd disqualify it because that noun doesn't exist. Well, at least I won't tolerate in a game of scrabble.

It's predictive-text-speak for Acey-Deucy ;)

No phonetic jokes please. I'm german and suffer from your damn homophones enough as it is.

I'm german and suffer from your damn homophones enough as it is.

Do you know which sound has five different spellings? six spellings? seven spellings?

Do you know which sound has five different spellings? six spellings? seven spellings?

By my count English has 18 different vowel sounds, while Spanish has 5.

For an English speaker to learn to speak Spanish they only need to learn ah-ay-ee-oh-oo, say them in the correct situation, and ignore the rest. A Spanish speak learning English has 13 (or more) additional vowel sounds they've never used in their life, so the tendency is to squeeze all 18 into the 5 they know.

Me:
Do you know which sound has five different spellings? six spellings? seven spellings?
You:
By my count English has 18 different vowel sounds, while Spanish has 5.

WHOOPS!
What I should have said was:

Do you know which sound has five homophones, i.e. words pronounced the same but with different spellings?
Six homophones?
Seven homophones!?

Do you know which sound has five homophones, i.e. words pronounced the same but with different spellings?
Six homophones?
Seven homophones!?

Not off hand, but perhaps you could offer an example. (That was an instance where I looked up 'elucidate' to find that it did not fit my intended meaning. It happens.)

By the way, to be clear, my comment was not in direct response to yours but rather an additional example to illustrate your point.

According to a site I found via Wiki, the sounds with most homophones in English are:

Five homophones: so, seau, sew, soe, sow
Six homophones: air, are, e'er, ere, err, heir
Seven homophones: raise, rays, rase, raze, rehs, réis, res

seau ... is a "pottery pail" popularly used in 18th century table settings
soe ... is a kind of large wooden tub,
sow ... is the one meaning to plant)
rase ... is a verb meaning "to erase"
rehs ... is the plural of reh, a mixture of sodium salts found as an efflorescence in India
réis ...is the plural of real, a currency unit of Portugal and Brazil
res ... is the plural of re, a name for one step of the musical scale

I cannot find anything to suggest that 'are' or 'err' may be pronounced the same as 'air'.
I cannot find any meaning for 'reh', the supposed singular of 'rehs'
I'm also unwilling to accept 'rase' and 'raze' as different words, merely alternative of spellings of the same word.

So, robberhands, no problems with our language. You'll never need to be bothered with any more than five homophones. :-)

I cannot find anything to suggest that 'are' or 'err' may be pronounced the same as 'air'.

In my neck of the woods, 'are' is pronounced the same as the single letter'r', while 'err' (the root of the word 'error') does sound the same as 'air.'

Then again, we say 'our' the same as 'are', and not at all like 'hour.'

Also, 'sowing your wild oats' is a different sound than 'a sow's ear.'

Seven homophones: raise, rays, rase, raze, rehs, réis, res

Rase looks to be an archaic form of raze, while réis is Portuguese.

The author later tried to justify the efficiency claim on the basis of how nuanced English is.

If I remember correctly, english has about a third more vocabels than german does. Oddly enough, sometimes I want to express something difficult in english but can't without retreating to my german roots. Whenever that happens, I struggle mightily with the available dictionaries to find an english term expressing exactly what I easily could say in german.

I struggle mightily with the available dictionaries to find an english term expressing exactly what I easily could say in german.

The best word I can think of to express my feelings about that is schadenfreude. :-)
On my first day in Berlin as a tourist I went on a guided walking tour of its sights. I twisted my ankle during the walk and that night at the hospital I learnt a new word in German, make that five new words in German, unterarmgehstutzen.

The best word I can think of to express my feelings about that is schadenfreude. :-)
On my first day in Berlin as a tourist I went on a guided walking tour of its sights. I twisted my ankle during the walk and that night at the hospital I learnt a new word in German, make that five new words in German, unterarmgehstutzen.

So Germany offered hospitality and healthcare to you, and you reciprocate with an emotion of 'Schadenfreude' to a german suffering from your needlessly cruel language?

a german suffering from your needlessly cruel language?

Some people love R but so far I'm monolingual in Python. They each have their strengths and weaknesses.

So Germany offered hospitality and healthcare to you, and you reciprocate with an emotion of 'Schadenfreude' to a german suffering from your needlessly cruel language?

Yep. That's about the size of it.
But, if you ever reciprocate by coming to Australia to enjoy our hospitality and you fractured an ankle, our health system would not charge you an arm and a leg to treat one leg. :-)

But, if you ever reciprocate by coming to Australia to enjoy our hospitality and you fractured an ankle, our health system would not charge you an arm and a leg to treat one leg. :-)

That just means Germany charged you without any form of discrimination, like a fellow countryman.

That's why they enter the Eurovision Song Contest.

If they have a reason to enter the Eurovision Song Contest, they are way ahead of every other European nation.

It's jealousy. Australians desperately want to be European and join the European Union.

Phooey!
Try a search for 'years without recession' on google.co.uk.

And as for the Eurovision song contest? Didn't Charlotte Church describe Britain's entry one year as "shit" and someone from the group responded with something like, "What a shame the 'voice of an angel' could come out of a potty mouth"?

"What a shame the 'voice of an angel' could come out of a potty mouth"?

Reckon she should have said 'shite' instead.

Reckon she should have said 'shite' instead.

She did say "shit" and "embarrassment", and the group responded with "mouth of a sewer".

I'd say she won when the song finished equal 22nd out of 24 finalists. Then again, maybe that song wasn't so bad. 22nd would be in the median position among all British entries in the ten years since then.

But recessions are good - Germany gives you lots of money eg Greece, Italy etc :)

I'm not going to respond to anything you say about this ...
Brexit will test who they're willing to give money to. :(

It was a joke. Didn't you see the smiley?

Mine was a needless dig - I just didn't want to get into a fight about something when you're looking at long-term social benefits and I'm seeing substantial medium-term economic damage.
The warning signs, based on nothing more than what I read in The Economist, are ominous. The "negotiations" are very lop-sided: 1 versus 26, with each of them having an effective veto over the entire deal. They'll end up demanding their highest common denominator.
The deadline would be ridiculous to just complete a complex trade deal in the best of conditions, or at least anything wide-ranging, and the EU is insisting terms of the exit must be agreed before negotiations of a new trade deal can start. The 'exit terms' are basically how much will Britain pay the EU to compensate it for the disruption its exit will cause them.
Your government is still squabbling internally over how hard the exit should be.
What I foresee is the British economy proceeding along the typical glide path of an advanced economy, like a rocket-powered elephant, and the rockets will be switched off for quite some time.
I hope for your sake I'm very wrong about how far the British economy will have fallen compared to the EU average from before the vote to where it will be in about five years time. My guess is that may end up close to what happened to the Greek economy when the EU "rescued" it. :(

It's jealousy. Australians desperately want to be European and join the European Union. That's why they enter the Eurovision Song Contest.

And what have been the scores by Australia and UK in the years since Australia first entered?

2017 AUS - 173 and UK - 111
2016 AUS - 511 and UK - 62
2015 AUS - 196 and UK - Five?!

And what have been the scores by Australia and UK in the years since Australia first entered?

2017 AUS - 173 and UK - 111
2016 AUS - 511 and UK - 62
2015 AUS - 196 and UK - Five?!

You gotta be from Down Under to freely admit you watch that shit, and even brag about the results.

You gotta be from Down Under to freely admit you watch that shit

I had no idea Australia had ever entered until AJ mentioned it.
And I wouldn't have mentioned the results if the UK did not suck so badly at sucking!

I had no idea Australia had ever entered until AJ mentioned it.

Me neither, that exonerates you but only partly. You still bragged about the results!

You gotta be from Down Under to freely admit you watch that shit,

Potty mouth!

Potty mouth!

Don't blame me, I learned your language through word of potty mouth.

I'd disqualify it because that noun doesn't exist. Well, at least I won't tolerate in a game of scrabble.

I doubt you'll find anyone here who supports the idea that authors are not entitled to make up words to create a special effect.
I wouldn't do it often, nor anywhere that's of little importance, but it's always allowed.
My criteria would be readers will easily understand what your invention means and realise no existing word satisfies your need.

We do not accept dictionaries may set standards for us here.

I thought better of using the N-word, even in jest. There is a country, with a fabulous football team, that never needs to hear that.

I doubt you'll find anyone here who supports the idea that authors are not entitled to make up words to create a special effect.

I still won't tolerate it in a game of scrabble.

We do not accept dictionaries may set standards for us here.

ETA: Your use of the Pluralis Majestalis scares me.

Pluralis Majestalis

I wouldn't allow it in scrabble either.
I wouldn't call my use the 'royal we' after I've introduced its antecedent with 'I doubt you'll find'. I've already acknowledged the possibility my opinion may not be universally accepted.

More astonishing to me is that AJ found my initial post worthy of a humorous one line response, whereas you seemingly feel compelled expelling all this drivel.

whereas you seemingly feel compelled expelling all this drivel.

Sort of. I didn't notice the "Well, at least ...".
With no smiley face I took it literally and tried to answer matter-of-factly.
"Drivel" seems a bit harsh. 'Not necessary' would certainly be justified.

OK, I can live with that! I happily re-call my 'drivel' remark if you'll stop accusing me of the heinous crime of nitpicking. That's the second time now. I do not nitpick. English is my second language, I'm not stupid enough fighting hopeless battles.

if you'll stop accusing me of the heinous crime of nitpicking. That's the second time now.

I WITHDRAW THAT.
When I reread your original post it was obviously intended as a joke/aside. I never complain when others intend that.
I'll keep your request in mind, and say I have seen enough evidence by now conclude that you are NOT a 'nitpicker'.
On this occasion what I reacted to was, my misinterpretation of, a suggestion that anything in a dictionary (or style guide) could be considered conclusive - even though I frequently quote them myself. That does get close to being a 'heinous crime' around here.
I apologise for over-reacting so much to the one instance of nitpicking I did see. I can honestly say I had not had a decent nights sleep in months. I have found a new source for my usual medication since then and my general mood has improved immensely.

assiduously

I examined the twins' almost identical butts assiduously. ;)

AJ

I had to lookup CMOS for what it means to authors. Until only a few minutes ago I only knew about the Silicon Valley CMOS:

Complementary metal–oxide–semiconductor, abbreviated as CMOS /ˈsiːmɒs/, is a technology for constructing integrated circuits. CMOS technology is used in microprocessors, microcontrollers, static RAM, and other digital logic circuits. (via Wikipedia)

I had to lookup CMOS for what it means to authors. Until only a few minutes ago I only knew about the Silicon Valley CMOS:

Hah!

There is an advantage to having flunked out as a CS major and switching to History/Literature/Philosophy as the quickest way to a BS, prior to obtaining my MLS; I recognize both terms, and understand them equally poorly!

Although, I wasn't exposed to CMOS as a CS major, 1980-1982; I was on the programming track, not the hardware track; the University of Oregon didn't have a hardware track at that time. I know about it because of assiduous reading of the PC popular press; I've assembled at least 15 PCs from scratch over the years.

And I never dealt firsthand with the Chicago Manual of Style, just the MLA Guide to Research Papers and the Harbrace Handbook.

MLS

The first two google pages searching for MLS give "Multiple Listing Service" (real estate) and "Major League Soccer." Might it be Masters in Library Science?

Masters in Library Science

Bingo! And shows just how useful Google really is. Although adding educational degree to the search would probably have improved the results.