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observations of a reader

railroadbob

I've been a member for quite a while, and have a few thoughts about what makes a quality story.
1. First, authors should use spell check, and grammar check.
2. Authors should use editors.
3. Editors should use spell and grammar check.

I can tell you that no matter how well a story flows, or how good the topic is, multiple, repetitive misspellings and poor grammar, sentence structure, are a distraction, and reduce the interest considerably.

I have read several stories recently that have all of the above, even after review by an editor, and not just a few instances, but very many.

That being said, I commend anyone who spends their time and energy working on stories to post here. I do appreciate your efforts.

I appreciate them even more when it is obviously a strong effort, and not half assed.
The imagination of many authors is impressive.

I thank all of you.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@railroadbob


authors should use spell check, and grammar check


Naturally, I can't, and won't, talk for every author here, but will respond on my behalf and on behalf of my editors.

We all do use spell checkers and grammar checkers. However, we're only human and some errors do slip by us all. For the author the most common reason to miss something is the mind reads what it expects to be there and not what really is. The other common error comes from a revision where the cut and paste doesn't go exactly as intended, or it alters the story rhythm and should have some words changed but get missed in the paste action. All such errors I fix when brought to my attention.

I've got two more points to make:

1. Spelling: I use International English with a tendency towards UK English. Every story I get complaints about not using US English. Well, stiff. It's properly spelled out English and passes the spell checker 99.99999% of the time. With the odd error I'll fix when I'm told about it.

2. Grammar: Please note that grammar and word choice changes with the writing style. Past tense as against present tense; Formal English as against Vernacular English. Many of the complaints I've had on grammar are due to the person complaining not understanding how the use of a tense or style other than what they're used to changes the way English is written, and it is still correct grammar. Again, any real errors reported will be fixed as soon as I'm told.

.....................

Having said all that, I agree that many of the authors here do need to pay more attention to their spelling, grammar, word choice, and use of localised terms. For most people around the world IHOP is how you say, in poor English, the way you move when you have a busted foot; but in the USA it's something to do with breakfast foods of some type.

typo fix edit

Replies:   richardshagrin
railroadbob

examples from one story;

She leant forward
She lent down
Xxxx was lent over her sister

Story supposedly reviewed by an editor.

I don't have a problem differentiating between US and UK English. Very easy to see the differences.

Replies:   Zom
Zom
Updated:

@railroadbob

reviewed by an editor

Untrue. Either it wasn't reviewed, or the reviewer wasn't an editor. Saying it doesn't make it so :-)

Leant is OK. 'Lent' and 'was lent' isn't in that context.

Replies:   TeNderLoin
richardshagrin

@Ernest Bywater

IHOP is International House Of Pancakes. Its a chain restaurant (many locations.) I don't know what makes it "international" perhaps locations in Canada? Relatively low prices. Lots of differently flavored (pancake) syrups. Somewhat like McDonalds the quality is not high, but it is predictable.

Ernest Bywater

@richardshagrin

IHOP is International House Of Pancakes.


Sorry, Richard, I know that, but I'd seen it 40 or 50 times in different stories before I found it out because the US authors assumed everyone in the world knew what is meant, yet a check on Wikipedia when I found out what it meant showed that it existed for over 40 years before it had a store outside of the USA, and is now in Canada and one store in Dubai (recently opened). I mentioned it to demonstrate that just because it's common in your part of the world it doesn't mean everyone knows it, so you should give the full name the first time you mention it in that story - same applies to any regional usage or any acronym. JCP for JC Penny is another one I ran across. Mickey Ds threw me for many years before I found out the US authors meant it as short for a Maccas (McDonalds). KFC is about the only one you can get away with because that's it's full name now, and has been for some years.

Just imagine how most US readers would interpret something like:

Dave said, "They had a bonza B&S bash at the Gong on the weekend. A ton of utes, and all loaded down with tinnies. Spent the weekend shit-faced on bludged VB."

Most won't know, until told: bonza = good or great (some will know that now); B&S = Batchelors and Spinsters Ball (singles party for late teens and twenties); Gong = Wollongong (slang name for city pronounced Woollen-gong); utes = utilities (think pick-up truck in the USA); tinnies = cans of beer; bludged = belonged to other people but he snagged it off them; VB = Victorian Bitter (brand of beer).

Switch Blayde

@Ernest Bywater

utes = utilities


Unless you're watching the movie "My Cousin Vinnie" where "utes" was the way he said "youths" with his heavy NY accent.

Ernest Bywater

@Switch Blayde

the movie "My Cousin Vinnie"


never seen it.

since the early days of motor vehicles in Australia the Utility Car was called a utility or a ute. Most are a sedan type front end with a tray on the back and are under 1 tonne in weight - basically a tray in place of the back half of a sedan - think El Camino. But it now also covers the 1 to 2 tonne trucks like the US pick-up.

Replies:   Wheezer  Joe_Bondi_Beach  Grant
Wheezer

@Ernest Bywater

that would be spelled 'pickup' as one word. Or pickup truck...

Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@Wheezer


that would be spelled 'pickup' as one word.


not according to any of the dictionaries I use, they all split at it as one word and want to split it or hyphenate it.

typo edit

awnlee jawking

@Wheezer

In English English too.

AJ

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@awnlee jawking

Is used to pick up girls? If not, what does it pick up?

Replies:   awnlee jawking
Joe_Bondi_Beach

@Ernest Bywater

like the US pick-up.


A "pick-up" is mostly, but not always, female, often found at truck-stops and just before closing time at the bar.

Not a motor vehicle.

And different from a pick-me-up.

bb

Replies:   richardshagrin  graybyrd
richardshagrin

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

How picky.

Bondi Beach

@Ernest Bywater

Dave said, "They had a bonza B&S bash at the Gong on the weekend. A ton of utes, and all loaded down with tinnies. Spent the weekend shit-faced on bludged VB."


"A really grouse feed," best Australianism I read the in "Les Norton" thrillers by the late butcher from Bondi, Robert G. Barrett.. Good source of Oz-speak.

Note that I said "butcher *from*" not "butcher of." He was a butcher, he worked in Bondi, and he retired on disability only to become a best-selling author.

http://newtownreviewofbooks.com.au/2012/09/24/robert-g-barrett-a-personal-farewell/

http://www.amazon.com/Robert-G.-Barrett/e/B001H9PYXG/ref=sr_tc_2_0?qid=1451334757&sr=1-2-ent

bb

Dominions Son

@richardshagrin

I don't know what makes it "international" perhaps locations in Canada?


AFIK: Pancakes served in different flavors/styles that come from many different countries.

Maybe they should have called it the House of International Pancakes.

Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater

A ton of utes


Why would you have 14 native Americans?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ute_people

~14 people at an average of 150 pounds to weigh one ton.

Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater

not according to any of the dictionaries I use


And how many American English dictionaries do you use? I have never seen it hyphenated or as two words in reference to trucks.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
sejintenej
Updated:

@Switch Blayde


utes = utilities

Unless you're watching the movie "My Cousin Vinnie" where "utes" was the way he said "youths" with his heavy NY accent.


I always knew it was something to do with them and just checked that a "ute" is a breed of Inuit dog/wolf.

As for IHOP wasn't he an Egyptian pharaoh? Certainly is elsewhere on SOL (but authors can make errors/up things.) As for the "International" I seem to recall that the USA had an International Baseball competition where only US teams could compete.

I go with EB that I try to write English but I do now understand the majority of American terms (but why the he** is Maryland a doctor of medicine - MD?

Railroadbob asked authors to use spellcheckers but EB's reply contained a classic demonstration of the weaknesses of any spellchecker: "other than what they're sued to changes the way English is written,".
Of course he intended to write "used" and any sensible reader will understand and make allowances for the fact that 50000 words cannot be individually examined with the human eye

Dominions Son

@sejintenej

"ute" is a breed of Inuit dog/wolf.


Ute is also the name of a native American tribe indigenous to the South West.

As for IHOP wasn't he an Egyptian pharaoh?


That would be Imhotep and no, he wasn't a pharaoh. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imhotep

awnlee jawking

@richardshagrin


If not, what does it pick up?


Dirt. So people can write "clean me" with their fingers.

AJ

Switch Blayde

@Ernest Bywater

not according to any of the dictionaries I use, they all split at it as one word and want to split it or hyphenate it.


Pickup, as in pickup truck, is one word. As to dictionaries, it was like that in the first one I checked: dictionary.com

Ernest Bywater

@Dominions Son

And how many American English dictionaries do you use?


I'd say, all up, I use a dozen or so dictionaries between the print ones I use and those built into software like Libre Office and Fire Fox.

BTW Fire Fox doesn't recognize pickup as a legal one word item.

Ernest Bywater

@sejintenej

Railroadbob asked authors to use spellcheckers but EB's reply contained a classic demonstration of the weaknesses of any spellchecker: "other than what they're sued to changes the way English is written,".


reported and fixed. Thanks.

And thus we see the difference between writing on the fly and when taking time to review things with an editor who'd pick that up.

BTW sued for used and teh for the are my two most common typos that occur due to my hands working at different speeds and sometimes the left hand fingers hit before they should.

Zom

@richardshagrin

I don't know what makes it "international"

Probably just following the lead set by the "World Series" in baseball.

Replies:   Rodeodoc
Dominions Son
Updated:

@Ernest Bywater

Many spell check "dictionaries" are seriously under-inclusive out of the box. In fact, in my opinion, they don't qualify as dictionaries at all.

The American English spell check "dictionary" I have installed on my copy of Open Office recognizes pickup as does Fire Fox, which I am using to post this.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Dominions Son

recognizes pickup as does Fire Fox


Interesting: I'm using Fire Fox vs 43 with its built-in dictionary and it keeps underlining pickup as a spelling error - maybe it's another of those words that only appears in US dictionaries.

JohnBobMead

@Ernest Bywater

maybe it's another of those words that only appears in US dictionaries.

Could be. It's one word in my paperback dictionary published back in 1989. Definition six for pickup is the truck.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@JohnBobMead

It's one word in my paperback dictionary published back in 1989.


My print US Dictionary by Readers Digest made in 1986 has pick-up truck in it. May have morphed in local US usage since then.

Joe_Bondi_Beach

@Ernest Bywater

Interesting: I'm using Fire Fox vs 43 with its built-in dictionary and it keeps underlining pickup as a spelling error - maybe it's another of those words that only appears in US dictionaries.


As long as we're talking about spelling and such, I have a browser called Firefox (43.0.3) loaded. Don't know a browser called Fire Fox.

bb

richardshagrin
Updated:

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

There is a topic on Author's Hangout about gauge of a shotgun. It would take a pretty big one to fire a fox.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@richardshagrin

big one to fire a fox.


Oh, I think a punt gun may handle a small fox as it's load!

Replies:   Dominions Son  Wheezer
Ernest Bywater

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

As long as we're talking about spelling and such, I have a browser called Firefox (43.0.3) loaded. Don't know a browser called Fire Fox.


so sue me. I've had a hell of a time changing from calling it by its original name of Netscape Navigator. For one short period they called it Fire Fox before going to Firefox, and I'm so slow to change I'm still trying to deal with that first change.

Switch Blayde

@Ernest Bywater

BTW Fire Fox doesn't recognize pickup as a legal one word item.


It does on my version of Firefox.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Dominions Son

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

I have a browser called Firefox (43.0.3) loaded. Don't know a browser called Fire Fox.


:-P

Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater


Oh, I think a punt gun may handle a small fox as it's load!


An AA gauge punt gun has a 4 inch bore. It could definitely handle a small fox, might even handle a large fox if you take the legs off first.

Ernest Bywater

@Switch Blayde

It does on my version of Firefox.


I just checked the tools etc, and it has the English (GB) Language Pack installed. So it's using a UK English dictionary. Must have picked that up off the system when I downloaded it.

Grant

@Ernest Bywater

the movie "My Cousin Vinnie"



never seen it.

Do yourself a favour, watch it. Excellent movie, very entertaining.

Grant

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

I have a browser called Firefox (43.0.3) loaded. Don't know a browser called Fire Fox.

Could be like the country called Vietnam. Many stories here have it as Viet Nam.

tppm

@Ernest Bywater

Speaking of spelling errors, where are you all getting this Fire Fox you're using? The product from Mozilla I use, and that I have been using since Netscape died, is Firefox.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@tppm

Speaking of spelling errors, where are you all getting this Fire Fox you're using?


Your only the 3rd person to point that out. :-P

Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

Interesting: I'm using Fire Fox vs 43 with its built-in dictionary and it keeps underlining pickup as a spelling error - maybe it's another of those words that only appears in US dictionaries.

As far as I know, "pickup" is a largely American term for "pickup" truck. Any other locations that use it probably import the same trucks and picked up the American usage. "Pickup" is considered a truck type (flat bed with a metal railings, used to carry supplies and accessing off-road areas. It's also the preferred truck across most of the south and west (all the 'good ol' boys' drive one).

I wouldn't expect any but U.S. dictionaries to include it.

Replies:   Dicrostonyx
Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I just checked the tools etc, and it has the English (GB) Language Pack installed. So it's using a UK English dictionary. Must have picked that up off the system when I downloaded it.

For those writing in a foreign dialect, like you, I'd recommend using dual browsers, each loaded with a different dictionary so you'll always know which dictionary is in use (though, to be fare, they tend to cross contaminate each other due to the common use of Google membership and other 'we only give you what you want to see' mentalities).

Replies:   tppm
sejintenej

@Ernest Bywater

I just checked the tools etc, and it has the English (GB) Language Pack installed. So it's using a UK English dictionary. Must have picked that up off the system when I downloaded it.

My UK English dictionary includes ONLY "pickup" with the third definition referring to the US use as "a small open truck for light loads".

Wheezer

@Ernest Bywater

How about a pun gun to use on all these bad jokes?

tppm

@Crumbly Writer

(though, to be fare,


Spell checking error "fare," the price for passage, for "fair," just.

graybyrd

@Joe_Bondi_Beach

Sorry, but if she's found at a truck stop, she's a "lot lizard."

One evening in an Oklahoma City truck stop, I watched a chubby rent-a-cop (security guard) try to run down a mini-skirted lot lizard. It was no contest. She hiked up her mini-skirt and duck-walked under the trailers while the truckers cheered her on. Chubby was too fat to follow. After awhile, she found a willing driver and hid in his sleeper cab until the chubby guard gave up and left.

Rodeodoc

@Zom

The Toronto Blue Jays are located in Canada, so the finally makes the "World" Series an international event.

Replies:   tppm
tppm
Updated:

@Rodeodoc

Both the Toronto Blue Jays and the Montreal Expos have been in the World Series in the past. But those are (were in the case of the Expos) the only teams outside the U.S. that qualify.

Replies:   Wheezer
Wheezer

@tppm

Both the Toronto Blue Jays and the Montreal Expos have been in the World Series in the past. But those are (were in the case of the Expos) the only teams outside the U.S. that qualify.


hehehe. That qualifies as an International Series. "World" is still quite a stretch. :D

Ernest Bywater

@Wheezer

That qualifies as an International Series. "World" is still quite a stretch.


When they gave the series a name the people involved thought there was no world west of the Pacific Ocean or east of the Atlantic Ocean. Now if they could find a way to include a few Japanese teams or even the top Japanese team they'd have a case for the name and title.

richardshagrin

@Wheezer

There aren't a lot of countries that play professional baseball. By that I mean the player's only employment, at least during the baseball season, is payments for playing baseball.

I can think of Japan, Mexico, some of the islands in the Caribbean like Cuba, and maybe Taiwan. There may be other Latin American countries that have professional baseball leagues. We have already included Canada which has some "minor league" teams in addition to Toronto and at one point Montreal.

A World Games of Baseball would include a relatively small number of nations. Probably Hockey has more world interest than baseball. Of course what we here in the USA call soccer and the rest of the world calls football is far more popular than almost any other sport. Except maybe racing vehicles using internal combustion engines (autos, motorcycles, trucks, buses, perhaps hydroplane and other motor boats. I don't think they have airplane races any more, if they do they may use jet engines.

Replies:   Grant
Grant

@richardshagrin

I don't think they have airplane races any more

Yep, the Red Bull Air Race.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Grant

Red Bull Air Race


Wow, how do they get the Red Bulls to race in the air? Do they chase them off a cliff and the one who gets out the furthest is the winner? Bet the make a lot of hamburger out of the losers, or is it over a sea cliff?

Replies:   tppm
tppm

@Ernest Bywater

Haven't you heard: Red Bull gives you wings.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@tppm

Haven't you heard: Red Bull gives you wings.


Being Red Bull, they'd have to be Buffalo Wings!

Replies:   sejintenej
Dicrostonyx
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer


As far as I know, "pickup" is a largely American term for "pickup" truck. Any other locations that use it probably import the same trucks and picked up the American usage. ...

I wouldn't expect any but U.S. dictionaries to include it.


The catch here is Canada. For the most part, Canadians use US slang, predominantly because of the amount of books, TV, film, and other pop-culture that makes it up here, but there is resistance to adopting US spelling and pronunciation.

While spelling is a bit of a mixed bag -- there are actual Canadian English dictionaries even though it isn't really thought of as a separate language -- a lot of slang words will use variant spellings from the US.

I would also use "pick-up truck", though some younger Canadians might not bother. The idea behind the spelling is that while "pickup" is being used as a single term, making "pick up" incorrect as it would imply an action, it would be grammatically incorrect to combine the two separate words into one word. Thus the hyphen is used as a concession to both theories: one term combining two words.

I suspect that many Brits would use the same spelling, for the same reasons. Brits would know the term "pickup truck" from films and TV, but would default to spelling it as "pick-up truck". In general, Britsh English still hyphentes many compound words which have become single words in American English: second-rate, part-time, take-off, well-known, low-level, etc.

This is changing, slowly, and even the Oxford dictionary has been listing an increasing number of words with the hyphen removed, but the Brtits have resisted the American tradition of hyphenless compounding.

Switch Blade


Pickup, as in pickup truck, is one word. As to dictionaries, it was like that in the first one I checked: dictionary.com


If you scroll down the page about half-way, there's an entry from the Online Etymology Dictionary:


n.

also pick-up, "that which is picked up," 1848; see pick up (v.). ...

ustourist

@Dicrostonyx

May I throw a spanner (wrench) in the works here?

Even in the highly unlikely event that the correct spelling of pick-up truck is agreed, you still have the problem of defining what a truck actually is legally.
Pick-up trucks can be licensed as a truck or farm truck on the number plate (tag), so are presumably a specific vehicle defined in law, but when road signs - which must be obeyed - state something like "no through trucks" then they are not included in that category of prohibited vehicles defined as trucks.
If the law doesn't appear to know what they are, how are the road users meant to know?

Replies:   Dominions Son  tppm  sejintenej
Dominions Son

@ustourist

Pick-up trucks can be licensed as a truck or farm truck on the number plate (tag), so are presumably a specific vehicle defined in law, but when road signs - which must be obeyed - state something like "no through trucks" then they are not included in that category of prohibited vehicles defined as trucks.


I have never seen such a sign anywhere I have been in the U.S.

What you may see is weight limits for trucks, but these limits are rarely low enough to affect pickup trucks.

http://www.trafficsign.us/r12.html

Switch Blayde

@Dicrostonyx

Thus the hyphen is used as a concession to both theories: one term combining two words.


Words evolve from being hyphenated to dropping the hyphenation. Look at the word makeup/make-up. Even in movie credits you see it spelled both ways. But I believe more people today would spell it "makeup."

tppm

@ustourist

In California the distinctions are commercial vehicle for vehicles used in business and noncommercial vehicle for passenger cars and the like. There's some differences based on weight, where vehicles over a certain weight have to be registered commercial. Small and medium sized puckups and SUVs may be registered as either depending on how they're used. And there are two reasons truck bypasses are built here, both based on the weight of the vehicle. One is the bypass has a shallower grade through a mountain pass, that the truck's breaks and transmission would be more likely to be able to handle, and two, to prevent wear and tear on the road surface.

sejintenej

@Ernest Bywater

Being Red Bull, they'd have to be Buffalo Wings!

I know women can have wings but buffalo?

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
sejintenej

@Dicrostonyx

I suspect that many Brits would use the same spelling, for the same reasons. Brits would know the term "pickup truck" from films and TV, but would default to spelling it as "pick-up truck".

My (British) Collins dictionary includes the unhyphenated pickup with the US meaning as the third of many meanings. The dictionary does not include the hyphenated version. I think hyphenation (? a valid word) is disappearing here and I would never use it for the small truck more commonly used in the USA

sejintenej

@ustourist

road signs - which must be obeyed - state something like "no through trucks"

We have an equivalent in France which means that trucks (i.e. transport vehicles) must not use the road unless they are going to destinations on that road; otherwise they must use a different route. Perhaps that is what is meant by your sign

Ernest Bywater

@sejintenej

I know women can have wings but buffalo?


Yes, they can, in the USA - it's a way of preparing chicken wings that you'll only hear of in the USA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_wing

Replies:   Zom  tppm
Zom

@Ernest Bywater

you'll only hear of in the USA.

EB. Mate. Where do you live? Here is a site publicising the Buffalo Wing Festival in Australia.
http://www.buffalowing.com.au/where-when/
Hang on - maybe we are a part of the US already!

Replies:   Ernest Bywater  Wheezer
Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@Zom


EB. Mate. Where do you live?


Urana, New South Wales. But even when I often visited my sister while she was a temporary Bannana Bender, we never heard of Buffalo Wings, but then, she lived in Roma, Qld not Brisbane.

I first came across Buffalo Wings in a story here at SoL, and, until now, never heard of them being anywhere outside the USA.

edit to add. If I lived much further south I'd be in Victoria.

Wheezer

@Zom

EB. Mate. Where do you live? Here is a site publicising the Buffalo Wing Festival in Australia.

http://www.buffalowing.com.au/where-when/

Hang on - maybe we are a part of the US already!


LOL! In this age of instant communications, satellite TV and internet, it's no surprise at all that Australia has learned the pleasures of fried chicken wings dipped in fiery hot sauce. Most Americans had never heard of grilled shrimp until Paul Hogan started offering to "throw a shrimp on the Barbie" in those Quantas commercials. :D

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@Wheezer

It wasn't Crocodile Dundee? the movie. oops, the film. I don't remember any Quantas commercials. Some story here on SOL indicated Quantas stood for Queensland and N? territories. N may have been northern. The as may have been Australia. May have been Peter Salas something about Gordon and Weena. The character wasn't thrilled about them as an airline.

Replies:   Wheezer  Ernest Bywater
Wheezer
Updated:

@richardshagrin


It wasn't Crocodile Dundee? the movie. oops, the film. I don't remember any Quantas commercials.


My mistake. The commercials were for the Australian Tourism Commission in the 1980's - before he did the Crocodile Dundee movies. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95OovSKEtfs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrimp_on_the_barbie

Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@richardshagrin


I don't remember any Quantas commercials. Some story here on SOL indicated Quantas stood for Queensland and N? territories. N may have been northern.


Qantas Airlines (Queensland and Northern Territory Air Services - see wikipedia link below) is the airline and there was a series of Australian Tourism advertisements run in 1984 (one YouTube link below) which starred Paul Hogan, some ended with him at a BBQ and saying he'll put an extra shrimp on the barbie for you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qantas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhHCnXGf43E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xn_CPrCS8gs

Replies:   Wheezer
Wheezer

@Ernest Bywater

The "shrimp on the barbie' commercials started in the US a couple of years before the first 'Dundee' movie. The popularity of the commercials helped make Hogan a familiar face to American audiences and helped make the movie a success.

tppm

@Ernest Bywater

So called because they allegedly were first prepared in Buffalo NY

Replies:   Ernest Bywater  Wheezer
Ernest Bywater

@tppm

So called because they allegedly were first prepared in Buffalo NY


That's my understanding from past research, but it does make for good jokes on them.

Wheezer

@tppm

So called because they allegedly were first prepared in Buffalo NY


I think it's pretty well accepted that buffalo wings were first created in Buffalo, NY. Who has the right to claim to be the first to serve chicken wings with sauce is debatable, although the near universal classic recipe of unbreaded fried chicken wings (dredged only in flour) tossed in a sauce made from Franks brand hot sauce and melted butter, served with celery sticks and bleu cheese dressing is pretty much accepted to be the Anchor Bar in Buffalo. Nobody else can document serving that recipe earlier.

TeNderLoin

@Zom

Leant is OK. 'Lent' and 'was lent' isn't in that context.


Well, "Leant" (mainly Brit) is to lean, incline
"Lent" is a religious period of time, or the past tense of loan.
:)

Replies:   Zom
Zom

@TeNderLoin

Yep, that's what I said, without the explanation :-)

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