Forum: Bug Report and Feature Requests

PUNK-CHEW-AY-SHUN

awnlee jawking 🚫

Sol's 'Writing Resources' contains a document entitled 'PUNK-CHEW-AY-SHUN'. At the end of the 'The Comma' section it states:

Do not use a comma before the first item or after the last item of a series:

The treasure chest contained three bottles of rum, some gold jewellery and five thousand pounds of silver. [WRONG]

The treasure chest contained three bottles of rum, some gold jewellery and five thousand pounds of silver. [RIGHT]

I can't see any difference between the 'wrong' sentence and the right 'sentence'.

AJ

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫
Updated:

@awnlee jawking

Based on his description of an error, the WRONG one should be:

…contained, three bottles… (which would be "a comma before the first item")

I have no idea what is meant by "or after the last item."

Replies: Dominions Son

Dominions Son 🚫

@Switch Blayde

I have no idea what is meant by "or after the last item." Is that referring to the Oxford comma? If so, it's not after the last item.

no, it says after the last item, the Oxford comma would be before the last item.

So the wrong sentence should be something like:

The treasure chest contained, three bottles of rum, some gold jewellery and five thousand pounds of silver, according to the treasure hunter who found it.

Replies: Switch Blayde Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Dominions Son

I guess you saw my Oxford comma comment before I edited it out.

In your "wrong" example, the comma is fine before the clause starting with "according."

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Dominions Son

I got it. I just wrote the following sentence:

It was a big, shoulder-lifting, chest-expanding sigh.

To make it his "wrong" example, it would be:

It was a, big, shoulder-lifting, chest-expanding, sigh.

Replies: awnlee jawking

awnlee jawking 🚫

@Switch Blayde

It was a, big, shoulder-lifting, chest-expanding, sigh.

Nice!

AJ

Replies: PotomacBob

PotomacBob 🚫

@awnlee jawking

How does it work when one of the terms has multiple words, i.e., "fish and chips"?
The dishes were cole slaw, pickled beets and fish and chips. (Makes it look like four dishes instead of three).

Replies: Switch Blayde awnlee jawking

Switch Blayde 🚫

@PotomacBob

The dishes were cole slaw, pickled beets and fish and chips. (Makes it look like four dishes instead of three).

That's fine. But the reason I use the Oxford comma is that is makes it even clearer.

The dishes were cole slaw, pickled beets, and fish and chips.

Replies: Ernest Bywater

Ernest Bywater 🚫

@Switch Blayde

The dishes were cole slaw, pickled beets, and fish and chips.

I'd write that as:

The dishes were coleslaw, pickled beets, fish and chips.

as the additional and makes it sound awkward.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Ernest Bywater

The dishes were coleslaw, pickled beets, fish and chips.

That would make "fish" and "chips" separate as in:

The dishes were fish, coleslaw, chips, and pickled beets.

rather than a fish and chips dinner.

Replies: Ernest Bywater

Ernest Bywater 🚫

@Switch Blayde

That would make "fish" and "chips" separate as in:

since I use the Oxford comma, it would list them as two separate items. However, since the list is of meal ingredients and not just whole meals, it wouldn't make much difference how they're listed.

awnlee jawking 🚫

@PotomacBob

The dishes were cole slaw, pickled beets and fish and chips.

How can you not put fish and chips first!

Infidel ;)

AJ

Replies: anim8ed

anim8ed 🚫

@awnlee jawking

Just saving the best for last is my guess.

madnige 🚫

Try it with this short menu list:

Steak and Ale Pie, Moroccan cous-cous and char-grilled vegetables, and Fish and Chips.

Only the penultimate 'and' needs and should have a comma preceding it; before any of the others, it removes one of the three items from the menu and replaces it with two non-meal items, and omitting it makes the list a two-item list with a four element meal as the second item. The Oxford comma is use of this comma where not needed for clarity. Although it is in the position an Oxford comma would be, the comma here is NOT an Oxford comma. Putting the Oxford comma into each of the sub-lists requires a change of punctuation for clarity, so the mini-menu becomes

Steak, and Ale Pie; Moroccan cous-cous, and char-grilled vegetables; and Fish, and Chips.

which I hope you'll agree is not very nice.

So there are times when an 'Oxford' comma is required (but then it's not an Oxford comma), and there are times when it's horrible.

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Forum: Bug Report and Feature Requests

PUNK-CHEW-AY-SHUN

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