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Change in story stats collection

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

As you all know, a couple of weeks back I implemented a measure to discourage bots on the site.

I've been refining the code and for now it works as expected (most of the time). I've fixed many many bugs.

Today I made yet another change, one that will affect download counts.

Previously, whenever anybody clicked a story's title, the click counted if the clicker was logged in and hasn't accessed it yet in the last 24 hours.

I made a change that many will be happy with (free members), but may give the impression to authors that they've lost readers.

As of now, clicking on a story's title doesn't always increment its counter. If it's a serial, no increment happens until the reader loads a chapter completely.

So, if they click and view the index only, the click does not count. If they click on a chapter and fail to click the 'click for the rest' button, then no click count. Only on loading the rest of the chapter that the counter is incremented. As in it's a real read. Not just somebody checking if the serial has been updated (not an actual read). So the way it works now is actual text accesses are counted, access to the index only for serials does not count anymore.

I deployed the change a couple of hours ago and as far as I can tell, the stats show a marked decrease in story download counts. Almost 50% down.

Before now, if somebody was using a bot, their downloads counted even if they failed to download the complete text, so I couldn't tell if the 'click to load' measure was effective or not. Now I can tell.

Switch Blayde ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

It may make authors feel better.

In the past, the first chapter always had many more downloads than the second chapter. The thought of readers abandoning the story while reading Chapter 1 or finishing Chapter 1 and not reading Chapter 2 was in my mind.

awnlee jawking ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

As of now, clicking on a story's title doesn't always increment its counter. If it's a serial, no increment happens until the reader loads a chapter completely.

When I'm trying to assist a 'Lost Story' search, I've always thought it 'interesting' that my accessing the story's page and clicking on 'show details' would increment the reader downloads count even though I might have no intention of reading the story.

It's academic, since nowadays I don't come anywhere near hitting the limit of stories I'm allowed to access in one day, but will the reader's 'stories read' still be incremented even though the 'story downloads' isn't?

As a marketing point, some sites count everything possible as a story download in order to make themselves look more attractive to readers and authors.

AJ

whisperclaw ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

I'd much rather have accurate stats than inflated ones.

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)
Updated:

@whisperclaw

I'd much rather have accurate stats than inflated ones.

Logically, everybody should.

However, huge numbers are seductive and gives some reason to brag.

I've been told by few authors that they stopped posting here because their download numbers didn't live up to their numbers somewhere else.

So I'm always hesitant when I do something like this and I've been thinking about it for weeks.

I even thought of creating two separate counters, one for the old method of gathering stats, and one that is accurate for my own stats, but I decided against it.

Hopefully authors understand.

Ernest Bywater ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

Hopefully authors understand.

I do understand, and I'm sure many of the other authors do as well.

awnlee jawking ๐Ÿšซ
Updated:

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

I even thought of creating two separate counters, one for the old method of gathering stats, and one that is accurate for my own stats, but I decided against it.

I've been using total downloads divided by number of chapters as an informal heuristic of relatively how many people are reading each serial. Comparisons between old stories and new stories will no longer be valid because they will no longer be comparing like with like.

ETA - isn't it going to make the Top Lists unreliable for the same reason?

AJ

Replies:   The Outsider
The Outsider ๐Ÿšซ
Updated:

@awnlee jawking

Top lists seems to be score-based, with ties going to stories with more votes for the story.

ETA: I initially meant the top long/short stories and all-time lists. I totally forgot about the other lists.

Replies:   Lumpy
Lumpy ๐Ÿšซ

@The Outsider

There is a "Top downloads" list which do go off the download count and would have to be adjusted or it'll only have stories pre-change listed.

Replies:   Grant
Grant ๐Ÿšซ

@Lumpy

There is a "Top downloads" list which do go off the download count and would have to be adjusted or it'll only have stories pre-change listed.

?
The Top downloads link on the left hand side with the other links is for stories over the last week.
So at most, things will be out for a week from the date Laz implemented the change. From that point on, everything in the list will be there under the new counter function, and none from the old one.

Vincent Berg ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

The changes all make sense, as this has been out outstanding issue for a long, long time. It to see it mostly resolved!

Quasirandom ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

If they click on a chapter and fail to click the 'click for the rest' button, then no click count. Only on loading the rest of the chapter that the counter is incremented.

What about premium members, who don't have to click? Does their loading a chapter count, because it's the full chapter?

And because I've been curious, how are ePub/txt/etc. downloads counted? Do they increment the count of every chapter or just of the whole book?

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Quasirandom

What about premium members, who don't have to click? Does their loading a chapter count, because it's the full chapter?

Yes. The counters are now incremented on full load and remainder of chapter. The only time they're not is for index page and partial load.

And because I've been curious, how are ePub/txt/etc. downloads counted? Do they increment the count of every chapter or just of the whole book?

Only the whole book/story.

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Switch Blayde ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

how are ePub downloads counted? Do they increment the count of every chapter or just of the whole book?

Only the whole book/story.

Does the single download count for the epub show up as a Chapter 1 download?

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Switch Blayde

Does the single download count for the epub show up as a Chapter 1 download?

No.

LOAnnie ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

As a much smaller time author than most who have responded I thank you. Yeah, it will be a little sad seeing much smaller numbers, but on the other hand I do think it's more realistic for the serials. It's pretty disheartening to have chapter 1 have like 5000 reads and chapter 2-10 only having a few hundred, especially knowing that the old load up counted it early.

robotica ๐Ÿšซ
Updated:

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

So, if they click and view the index only, the click does not count. If they click on a chapter and fail to click the 'click for the rest' button, then no click count. Only on loading the rest of the chapter that the counter is incremented. As in it's a real read.

Presumably any chapter that is so short that doesn't have "click for the rest" (e.g. prologue/epilogue of some stories) will retain the old behaviour?

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@robotica

Yes.

Replies:   Mat Twassel
Mat Twassel ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

I was going to ask the same question as robitica. My little stories posted on the 18th and 19th received many fewer downloads on the first day than is typical, about 25% of the usual. The number of votes for these stories was no different from the usual number of votes for my stories, which seems to indicate that the readership was about the same as always. I'm curious why the download count was so low for those two days. The download count for the story posted on the 20th was somewhat higher, but still markedly less than normal.

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Mat Twassel

Since I introduced the 'click to load' button, download counts have dropped by about 40%. For a while the robots were trying and due to the method of gathering stats counting partial downloads, it didn't drop too much.

Short stories (any text that is shorter than 5KB) should retain the same method of stats gathering as before the method change, but robots are hitting the site way less too. So even for shorter stories/chapters, the counts will be lower simply because those running the robots don't seem to be interested in shorter texts.

solitude ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

I've noted a slight inconsistency has crept into the system. Just visiting the index page of a story does not affect the stories visited count any longer (thanks!), but it does affect the 'last accessed' timestamp visible in the story's 'more info' page.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater ๐Ÿšซ

@solitude

I've noted a slight inconsistency has crept into the system. Just visiting the index page of a story does not affect the stories visited count any longer (thanks!),

Please clarify exactly which counts you're looking at. There are two counts in the system that I'm aware of, one is for the chapters as an individual chapter, and the other is for the story as a whole, and the totals for individual chapters together never match the count for the story as a whole due to the differences in how they count.

For example, a story with 10 chapters and someone reads all of the chapters in one day each chapter will get a count of 1 and the story will get a count of 1 - but should they read 5 chapter today and 5 chapters tomorrow each chapter will get a count of 1 while the story will get a count of 2 due to being accessed by the same reader on 2 different days.

Due to the above there are 2 actions that lead to count oddities. (a) if someone goes to the index page for any reason that will get a count of 1 for each visit, regardless of what they do after that, while (b) a story posted over time will often have an extra count of the previous chapter posted because people who bookmarked it on a previous day will often be taken to that page by the bookmark prior to going on to the new chapter.

Also, the story title page doesn't always count as a visit to the story.

Replies:   solitude
solitude ๐Ÿšซ
Updated:

@Ernest Bywater

Please clarify exactly which counts you're looking at.

Suppose I go to the home page of the SF site, and the first line says my username and [7/300]. Next I visit the more info page for a new story that I have not read. No info here about the last time I accessed the story. Refresh, no change. Now click the title, which takes me to the index page of the story as it's a multi-chapter one. Now click the more info button on the index page. It now contains additional info: in this case, "Last Accessed:

02/12/2021, 23:13:48". (You now guess my time zone, if you wish. And also tell I'm a slow typist.) Click on the home page button, and the download counter this period still shows 7.

So, visiting the index page of a story does not affect the count of the stories I have read/downloaded 'today', but the system does know I have 'accessed' the story.

As I said before, a minor point. But if I follow a link to a story index page in a forum post and then go to the more info page (to see if any chapter has been updated since I last looked at the story, the 'last accessed' data will have set to now, and I can't tell when I actually read part or all of the story.

(Edited to correct minor typo. It would be nice to be able to have a way to review the post prior to submission.)

Paladin_HGWT ๐Ÿšซ

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

I appreciate more accurate stats. I only have a few stories, and relatively small readership; so, more accurate stats are valuable to me.

My stories have little or no sex, however, I believe this site is better than most out there. Thus I am posting on SOL, Fine Stories, and will ad some of my stories to SCI Fi Stories too.

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