Forum: Author Hangout

A reversal to "Owed to Authors"

ystokes 🚫

It's a good thing I don't care what people think of me as I am sure some of you will not have any kind words to me.

But do authors owe anything to the readers who become involved with the stories?

Case in point, there is a author on SOL that has 13 completed books for sale on bookappy yet on his SOL page he has 10 of those on his page with only one story completed and the other 9 get a new chapter updated weeks or even over a month. I can understand an author taking a long time between chapters on one story. But on 9 at the same time?

Replies: Switch Blayde TMax fohjoffs jimq2

Switch Blayde 🚫

@ystokes

But on 9 at the same time?

That was like the author I mentioned in my thread on publishing novels out of copyright. He's doing that with 4 novels. I wonder if when the 4 are complete, another 4 will pop up. He's slow on updates, but a month seems too long. I thought SOL had a rule about how long it could be.

But the only thing he owes his readers is to keep the updates coming and complete the story on SOL. If he doesn't complete it and it's on bookapy, Lazeez will complete it for him on SOL.

Replies: Sarkasmus

Sarkasmus 🚫

@Switch Blayde

I thought SOL had a rule about how long it could be.

Yeah, I complained about that when we had the discussion about the AI-Slop flooding the site. Apparently, that rule only applies if you have stories completed on external sites. Like, if the completed book is on Amazon, or your patreon page.
If the completed books are on zbookstore, you can play the tease-and-milking-game with your readers for as long as you want.

TMax 🚫

@ystokes

taking a slight tangent

Yes, authors owe readers, but they can't always deliver (either side); ultimately, the author/reader relationship is transactional, and not one-way only. Traditionally, and with very good authors (ie: not me :), the transaction is money for story.
When you publish for free and read for free, the transaction is by donation (readers - comments, votes; writers - more chapters, actual good writing :)

Just my thoughts....for what they are worth (ie: given freely, not even asked for).

Replies: solreader50

solreader50 🚫

@TMax

This response is getting a round of applause from me.

fohjoffs 🚫

@ystokes

Someone said that what is owed is 'transactional', and works both ways. Another implied that the writer could be considered unethical if he is using incomplete stories on SOL to sell his stuff.

I still maintain that, as a writer, I do not 'owe' shit to the reader; and the reader does not owe shit to me.

But, and it is a very big but, we all 'owe' something to Laz for this site and his sense of fairness and equity, whether a writer or reader.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@fohjoffs

the writer could be considered unethical if he is using incomplete stories on SOL to sell his stuff.

That is more than unethical. It violates SOL's rules and not allowed.

Replies: Michael Loucks

Michael Loucks 🚫

@Switch Blayde

That is more than unethical. It violates SOL's rules and not allowed.

It is permitted to have a book for sale on ZBookstore or Bookapy and post chapters on a regular schedule on SOL, even if it takes months.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Michael Loucks

It is permitted to have a book for sale on ZBookstore or Bookapy and post chapters on a regular schedule on SOL, even if it takes months.

Yes, and that's true even if it's for sale elsewhere, but when he said, "if he is using incomplete stories on SOL to sell his stuff," I assumed he meant leaving it incomplete.

Replies: Sarkasmus

Sarkasmus 🚫
Updated:

@Switch Blayde

Yes, and that's true even if it's for sale elsewhere

As I wrote before, no, it is not.

Author Agreement paragraph 17A:

Any promotional links or text to sell your complete books are allowed only if they point to our book shop ZBookStore.com. Progress must be made at least bi-weekly until the work is complete on Storiesonline.

Now, the size of those bi-weekly updates is not defined, but from what I see on the site so far, it seems that, as long as the "last updated" date on a story isn't older than two weeks, you're golden. So, as long as you post a single sentence every two weeks, you can sell the completed work on bookapy/zbookstore for years.

However, if the story is completed on an EXTERNAL site, like a Patreon page or your own story site, suddenly, your story on SOL must be completed WITHIN two weeks, or it constitutes "teasing" (according to Paragraph 17C of the very same Author Agreement):

[...] You must keep the work on Storiesonline within two instalments of the work on the support site. If the work is completed on the support site, then it must be completed on Storiesonline within two weeks of the completion on the support site.

Replies: Switch Blayde awnlee jawking

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Sarkasmus

according to paragraph 17A, you just have to update "at least bi-weekly until the work is complete on Storiesonline".

I don't have anything on an external site like Patreon so I thought what's in paragraph 17A (quoted above) was the rule for having the story anywhere other than SOL. But it makes sense for two rules because one has to be for external sites that publish by chapter while the other has to be for sites where the novel is fully published in its entirety and not posted a chapter at a time.

Lazeez has been very accommodating to authors who want to make some money. But he also has a commitment to his reader base. Authors should abide by the rules and not cheat or game the system. If they do, we all lose.

awnlee jawking 🚫

@Sarkasmus

Progress must be made at least bi-weekly

That's ambiguous. Does it mean twice a week or every two weeks?

AJ

Replies: Sarkasmus

Sarkasmus 🚫

@awnlee jawking

That's ambiguous.

It's actually a well-defined term in the English language, and means every two weeks.

Replies: Michael Loucks madnige

Michael Loucks 🚫
Updated:

@Sarkasmus

It's actually a well-defined term in the English language

A word or phrase being 'well-defined' does not make it unambiguous to the population as a whole. See 'inflammable'. Or ask a Brit and an American what 'tabled' means with regard to legislation.

Then there are contronyms…😜

madnige 🚫

@Sarkasmus

It's actually a well-defined term in the English language, and means every two weeks.

... or, twice a week
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/biweekly

I'd use 'every other week', or better still 'fortnightly' for the 'about twice a month' interpretation. Because these two unambiguous terms are available, I'd interpret 'bi-weekly' as twice per week.

Replies: Switch Blayde

Switch Blayde 🚫

@madnige

'fortnightly'

As an American, I had to look that up. It's not a word Americans would use.

It's derived from "fourteen nights" so it's actually pretty cool.

I always thought biweekly was confusing.

Replies: Michael Loucks Dominions Son

Michael Loucks 🚫

@Switch Blayde

It's not a word Americans would use.

Except my entire circle of friends, plus my kids, plus their friends…and we're all Americans.

It appears several times in my stories posted to SOL.

Dominions Son 🚫

@Switch Blayde

@madnige

'fortnightly'

As an American, I had to look that up. It's not a word Americans would use.

We might not use it, but any Americans who are fans of fantasy or Medieval fiction are likely to recognize it.

jimq2 🚫

@ystokes

And twice a week would be semi-weekly.

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Forum: Author Hangout

A reversal to "Owed to Authors"

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