Do the old traditional paper routes for kids still exist? Where I live, newspapers these days are delivered by adults in cars; the newspapers are wrapped in plastic and flung into the driveway. The bill for the newspaper comes in the mail (or maybe online).
They're kind of still a thing but have mostly given way to the central newsagent and his car. one thing that is an alternative though is 'junk mail' delivery. at least around here kids with some parental support can take on a segment over which to deliver 'junk mail'. these systems pay per item, normally expressed as per 100 or per 1,000. there will be a preset day of delivery and normally many concurrent items to deliver. the rate may seem generous until you consider that you are not covered for your 'time' including preparation time during which you are likely to fold and collate your items ready for delivery. an 'area' or segment will likely be 3-500 addresses in a concentrated group of blocks. if you're lucky you may get some apartment blocks and be able to deliver to many mailboxes simply and quickly or you may have to hump it over drawn out blocks where each letterbox is several meters apart. normally it will be some sort of mix of these depending on the area you live in. I've done this as a 'job' on and off for a number of years and locations so have first hand experience and this is the most direct current day equivalent to the paper-route.
In my area (west coast Canada), there are kids deliveries not for the main newspaper, but for a local community paper. Not sure how financing works; it's a weekly free paper and no one ever goes door-to-door for payments.
I assume the paper is funded out of taxes and the kids are paid a small wage. The paper itself is specifically community news: upcoming civil projects and meetings, local events, small businesses, etc.
It's probably funded by advertising and event postings. That's how the free local papers I'm familiar with have always worked.
I delivered one of those when I was a kid, but that was 35 years ago and I believe they've gone out of business now. The actual regional newspaper of note here is barely staggering along. My mom still has a subscription, but mainly just as a daily crossword delivery. It's worthless for anything else. They're well into the death spiral of hemorrhaging readers because the content and quality are dropping, while the content and quality are suffering because they can't afford to pay competent reporters or copy editors because they've lost so many subscriptions...
Not really. At least not in most of the US, unless you live in a small town where a local newspaper somehow manages to make enough money to afford deliveries.
Basically, like everything, it was optimized away. In order to have the papers (regardless of newspapers, community letters, or junk mail) delivered by paper carriers, they need to be delivered to some kind of storage where it is then sorted into the different routes the kids can manage with their bikes and picked up by said kids.
Now, at some point, people realized that it is WAY cheaper to simply let the car bypass the second distribution center and just have them deliver all the papers directly. Thanks to them using a car, it's also much faster and more reliable than a bunch of kids.
Most of them likely died along with the afternoon edition papers.
I know in LA into the 1970s, we had three major papers. Two of them (LA Times and the "Green Sheet" (Daily News) were early morning deliveries and always done by adults. But the Herald-Examiner was an afternoon paper, and most of those were delivered by local kids. The papers were delivered to their homes after they got out of school, so they could be delivered in time for the customers to have them waiting when they got home from work.
But I know in LA, the Herald was gone by 1989. And I think that was the last major news chain that had their main edition delivered in the afternoon.
I had a paper route as a kid. We collected the money from our customers and we were paid as a cut of our collections.
A lot of things killed the youth paper routes.
Mail billed subscriptions
As you mentioned the death of afternoon editions.,
But tightening child labor restrictions also had an impact.
The paper I delivered for had both a morning and an afternoon edition. They killed youth delivery routes years before they stopped the afternoon edition.
They were getting shit from both the government and activists over "working conditions" for the kids doing delivery.
But tightening child labor restrictions also had an impact.
Actually, newspaper delivery had always been exempt from the child labor laws. Primarily because they were not paid hourly but got a percentage of what they collected.
[quote]Section 13(d) of the Act provides an exemption from the child labor as well as the wage and hours provisions for employees engaged in the delivery of newspapers to the consumer. This provision applies to carriers engaged in making deliveries to the homes of subscribers or other consumers of newspapers (including shopping news). It also includes employees engaged in the street sale or delivery of newspapers to the consumer. However, employees engaged in hauling newspapers to drop stations, distributing centers, newsstands, etc., do not come within the exemption because they do not deliver to the consumer.[/quote]
I knew the paper in Idaho had problems getting kids for their only edition which was early morning, as they had to get a parent to drive them to pick up the papers (as opposed to afternoon where it dropped them off at their house), and that they might not finish a route before they had to stop and leave for school. Most of those that delivered those tended to be retired, college kids, or moms.
Section 13(d) of the Act
To what act are you referring? States can have their own child labor laws that can be more restrictive than federal law.
This is from the Netherlands. When I was 12 I started delivering morning papers. At the time papers were delivered to a local depot where we picked up the papers for our route. Most depots handled between 8 and 15 routes. The depot 'manager' counted the papers out for each route in a designated spot where we parked out bike to load the papers. We got 2 extra papers which we could either sell, replace a damaged paper, or of course keep as a paper for our own family. I did this for years and for different papers. One route I did had three different papers I delivered in a single route. On Wednesdays afternoons I had a route with a weekly local paper with multiple advertising leaflets we had to fold into the weekly paper before we delivered them. Both the weekly paper and the leaflets were delivered to our home so we didn't have to fold-in the leaflets at a depot. Routes were paid based on both the length of the route and the number of papers. So you could have a short route with many papers (many apartment buildings in it) or a long route with fewer papers that paid the same if the required time was the same. The weekly paper was interesting because we were paid extra for each advertisement leaflet. The first thing I checked after the papers were delivered was how many advertisement leaflets there were!
I checked and until today this still works exactly the same way but the minimum age for the weekly day paper is now 13 and you can't work more than 2 hours a day. The minimum age for the morning papers is now 15 and you can't start before 6 AM.
Around 19 or 20 (I don't remember exactly) I went "at step up" (after not delivering papers on a bike for a few years) by driving a van and picking up papers at the printer and deliver them to the depots. Of course this was night work. Pickup at midnight at the printer and drive a route to the depots. This is also still the same today. One delivery route delivered directly to the paper boys homes because they had routes way out in the farm areas where a depot would be too far away to pick up the papers.
After that I wised up and started studying and working in IT :D
After that I wised up and started studying and working in IT :D
Please tell me there is a Heavy dose of sarcasm in that line. I've worked IT for over 30 years and am ecstatic to see the back of it. It's not the industry it once was and both the culture and client expectations have changed very dramatically. I'd go as far to say that IT has the worst 'customers' of any industry you care to mention.
Back to the point:
I used to deliver both junk mail and community papers (folding and insets would vary wildly). they went out the same way from the same collection point. Problem with the paper was you had to buy rubber bands on your own dime or delivery was a nightmare so you didn't make much after that cost. Or you accounted for the prep time. yes you did this in front of the telly and it became automatic very quickly. Normally what I'd do is have a medium sized backpack that was basically an open barrel, in addition to the bag I'd use a double wheeled wheelbarrow that had a simple 'J' handle so you could pull it with one hand and hurl the 'current' load straight out of the bag. One bag plus one wheelbarrow load would hold around 300 items. If you ignored the effort to hump yourself, bag and barrow to the delivery area you got a buttload of exercise at least 3 days a week.
On a different note I know a guy who has a paper delivery route. not to homes mind you, but to newsagents. They go to the DC around midnight and then drive their area putting out parcels on the door of each agent. This would take a fair few hours. Making it a standard work day-ish. It's all done under contract and a recognised business of high repute. normally there is no issue with bringing in the papers/magazines as the news agent knows roughly when the drop off will be and they tend to open around 0500 the bundles don't have to hang round long. the only time I've seen this break down is all of that day's papers, nothing else were made off with, presumably because someone didn't want the locals reading something in that day's paper.
It's not the industry it once was
Let's assume that Keet worked in IT back when it was "once was", I also did (mostly).
What was the expression? "When men were men and sheep were nervous".
the world has moved on from professions and trades being looked on with any form of respect. one of the reasons there is a near universal skill deficit at the moment.
of course I now have Monty Python doing the lumberjack song but my brain is trying to insert IT lyrics in place of the originals. perhaps I should just listen to 'weird al' white and nerdy or maybe something by Eben Brooks', Hey There Chthulhu, It's the end of the Verse as we know it or Gettin' Geeky.
If you don't know them do yourself a favour and look them up.
Let's assume that Keet worked in IT back when it was "once was",
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. Freyrs_stories is right, it's not the same as back then but in my niche it's virtually unchanged.
Please tell me there is a Heavy dose of sarcasm in that line. I've worked IT for over 30 years and am ecstatic to see the back of it. It's not the industry it once was and both the culture and client expectations have changed very dramatically. I'd go as far to say that IT has the worst 'customers' of any industry you care to mention.
Almost 40 years now but I'm in a relatively small niche with my own company for almost 20 years now. I've kept it deliberately small so I could keep enjoying it. Very few customers but some are 15+ years with my company. Still love it :)
Oh I love computers in all their aspects. been on the bleeding edge for what must be over 40 years, I'm not yet 50, so a significant proportion of my life. but over lets say the last 20 years I have grown disillusioned with and hate 'IT'. from completely ignorant users/managers to the degradation of knowledge and 'arts' involved and people who have a negative IQ when it comes to even remotely understanding the scope the field now covers, it's become a mugs game with next to no pay off, appreciation or job surety.
I think the only people less appreciated are family doctors, GPs, whatever you want to call them. both industries are beyond plagued by Google experts who wouldn't know shit from clay if there wasn't a 5 step questionnaire written by some minimum wage university reject just trying to put food on the table for another week with no idea of the chaos and absolute ruin they unleash on the professionals and short bus public who are miss represented / informed by the drivel they write.
The internet is not what it once was;
instead of Altavista we have an advertising company who seems to make it their primary mission to infuriate anyone who wants to find something that is not a cat video or one of the ads they take money to show.
the average IQ of someone 'online' has plunged so sharply downwards it's at risk of forming a singularity and not the kind that leads to 'intelligence'
speeds, if you can access them geographically and financially have done nothing but make sure you have no idea where you are nor what you have transmitted and received. yet we are evermore reliant on to do the most basic of things that we could once do with little more than a glorified screeching sound card at 14.4Kbps if you were extra lucky and you were kicked off ever two hours or so.
Yes I will acknowledge we are 'permanently' online and services can now provide you with with multiple downloads a day. each of which would have given a publicly traded ISP kaniption fits if they were drawn out over a month or more.
Yes the technology has advanced but the user base has gone so far backwards you might as well be handing out britanica DVDs to ugg and grug in a Mesopotamian slate based correspondence school a thousand years before anyone worked out that new fangled cuneiform joke.
I have swung from enthusiast to hermit praying someone else doesn't remember I out of the ten thousand people they now 'know' understands the difference between a silicon chip and a Pringle.
I've forgotten enough information and knowledge to make that Britanica DVD weep in fear and misery. I remember bringing 5 1/4" floppies up to a temperature they could be read at and building joystics with a soldering iron and tin snips because no store sold them locally let alone a multi-national that could ship you 100 variations on plastic so cheap coke would be embarrassed to make bottles out of it overnight.
Yes I'm a curmudgeon but technology isn't an arrow flying straight, it's a bloody see-saw and nobody thinks about how they got way up there off the ground until the 'other guy' suddenly gets off 'cos they're not part of the 'fun'
Are there exceptions yes, am I a bitter cynic who's been asked to drive 2+ hours each way to flick a switch once too often after being told by 5 separate people it had been, oh hell yes.
IT consists of two 'things' 95% undoing someone else's fuck up 5% trembling something that only released 5 minutes ago is already out of date or has broken what you spent 6 months understanding inside out and will never be relevant again.
I love computers but I hate IT with the passion of a billion burning suns, not as someone tried diligently to educate me, powered by coal.
Keet, if you have your niche hold onto it like you hope your daughter holds on to her virginity and maybe throw me a hint or two on how you stay sane/positive
Keet, if you have your niche hold onto it like you hope your daughter holds on to her virginity and maybe throw me a hint or two on how you stay sane/positive
I will hold on to my niche, hopefully for another 5-7 years until I retire.
My daughters are a bit too old to still have their virginity :D One already gave me two grandchildren and the other is getting married next year.
the other is getting married next year.
so there may be some hope ;)
best of luck with your 5-7 year 'target'.
people are notorious for overestimating changes 2 years out and under 10 years out. can't remember where I read that but it has held true at least for my experience over the last 30+ years since then and I'm sure anyone with more years than me will be happy to push that number proportionally.
I got worried that my particular IT niche was going to become obsolete and looked at a couple of new jobs back around 1985. In the end I decided not to take them (good idea, one was on a Wang machine) and retired in 2018 without having really changed specialities.
best of luck with your 5-7 year 'target'.
people are notorious for overestimating changes 2 years out and under 10 years out.
That's what I thought 10 years ago but so far it's still going on.
I think the only people less appreciated are family doctors, GPs, whatever you want to call them. both industries are beyond plagued by Google experts
I've found Dr Google to be invaluable in correcting wrong information given to me by doctors. You just have to be careful to find reputable sources rather than social influenzas.
AJ
reputable sources
Mayo Clinic, Johns Hopkins, Stanford, Cleveland Clinic, and University of Chicago are all excellent sources of reliable information. There are others, of course, but those are my 'go to' sources.
Johns Hopkins
University of Chicago
It's claimed that in 90% of peer-reviewed published medical studies, the conclusions of the authors are not supported by the underlying data. IMO, those two institutions are above-average contributors to the count of weak studies.
AJ
A risk for ANY medical information you find anywhere. Unless you subscribe to one of the publishing sites and ahave full access to research (not just abstracts), mostly the best you can do is read multiple sites and compare and contrast.
Front-line doctors are notoriously bad sources of information, I've used studies (including from the aforementioned 'poor' sources to refute things my doctor has said which I know to be wrong from personal research.
So, as with the news, you read as many sources as possible, synthesize a conclusion, and do your best with the limited informaiton available to determined if your synthesis is correct.
Some basic medical knowledge helps, as you can understand whaen you're reading BS. That's a major problem given that doctors in medical schools are taught the 'party line' and researchers goal-skek rather than do research.
Bottom line — any single source can be biased. That's why I listed the above as 'sources' of reliable informaiton. They are, so long as you vet any information by cross-checking and against basic biochemisry.
Some basic medical knowledge helps
I'm thinking more from the statistical angle. Some study protocols are so poor as to make it impossible for anything useful to be learned from the studies except as anecdotes.
AJ
I'm thinking more from the statistical angle. Some study protocols are so poor as to make it impossible for anything useful to be learned from the studies except as anecdotes.
Agreed.
It's claimed that in 90% of peer-reviewed published medical studies,
The figure I recall seeing is 80%, and it's not just medical studies.
Across all fields, a majority of published research is impossible to reproduce. Even the hard sciences like physics and chemistry are affected.
Google "replication crisis".
From what I've read on it I would say that there are three major drivers for this.
1. Universities have made publication the primary performance measure for faculty rather than teaching.
2. Journals do not like to publish replication studies, they have a strong preference for original research.
3. Journals do not like to publish research with negative results.
#3 leads to p-hacking. Taking the data from research project that led to rejecting the original theory and mining the data for any "statistically significant" effects.
