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Natural Love Resort

EazinAlong

I want to know whether there are other established authors who would like to work with me to launch a new SOL universe.

The universe I'm considering is tentatively called "Natural Love Resort," and it's set on an unnamed Caribbean island. Nearly every manner of sexual peccadillo is tolerated (I'm open to suggested limits here; see below), but incest and teens are strongly encouraged. Exhibition and nudity are virtually unavoidable. :-)

Families already engaged in incest might visit Natural Love Resort for like-minded company, a tolerant atmosphere and perhaps some kid swapping. Families considering incest might visit for the final push over the edge.

And it might not all be incest. There could be D/s parties, underage parties and public initiations. Swapping would be rampant.

Each story would revolve around a specific guest/family and its adventures. Each author would have freedom to set the family's baseline when it arrives -- ages, relationships, experience levels, etc. -- and then create the family's story while they're at Natural Love Resort. Just send every customer home happy.

All stories must comply with SOL guidelines.

This post is a request for:

-- Expressions of interest from established SOL authors who might contribute an early story to help build momentum. I'm asking established authors because they have experience, but if this launches, any author would be welcome.

-- Suggested guidelines. I have certain categories I'd exclude, such as bathroom functions, dead people, excessive violence/pain and extreme rape. I want advice about this topic.

-- Any other suggestions.

The most successful version of this, to my knowledge, is the "Naked In School" universe, which has generated some terrific stories.

What are your thoughts?

Replies:   Crumbly Writer  taz40
Crumbly Writer

@EazinAlong

This post is a request for:

-- Suggested guidelines. I have certain categories I'd exclude, such as bathroom functions, dead people, excessive violence/pain and extreme rape. I want advice about this topic.

I'd suggest setting up the different 'parks', one for each 'kink', so no one would be exposed to something they're uncomfortable with (what parent would want to freak out their kids by exposing them to heavy-duty BDSM?). You should name each one, specify what it accepts, where it's located, what the 'park' looks like and set up how the staff is supposed to operate.

Since SOL already restricts it anyway, I'd suggest you have the resort comply with existing international law and restrict based on age (say only 16+), and have a Customs agent checking passports as everyone exits the plane/enters the resort. That way, no one will be tempted to cheat.

A 'first pass' story to establish the universe can investigate a single park, outlining the structure and have the characters focus on a single vacation. Other authors could then investigate the other parks with new characters, building the universe as they go.

But then, I'm a bit of a control freak as far as stories go! 'D

Replies:   EazinAlong  Bondi Beach
richardshagrin
Updated:

A very different National Park Service. Ranger Bob, anyone? For the incest park.

Lubrican is the obvious author for the story, Bob's his uncle (to quote a Britishism).

Replies:   red61544
EazinAlong

@Crumbly Writer

Thank you. Great suggestions.

red61544

@richardshagrin

Damn! What a coincidence. My girlfriend says BOB is her best friend!

Bondi Beach

@Crumbly Writer

I'd suggest setting up the different 'parks', one for each 'kink', so no one would be exposed to something they're uncomfortable with (what parent would want to freak out their kids by exposing them to heavy-duty BDSM?). You should name each one, specify what it accepts, where it's located, what the 'park' looks like and set up how the staff is supposed to operate.


Why not let that be a part of the developing story, God (AKA EazinAlong) takes on that task over the course of a few stories, or as contributors describe how families arrive and work through how to handle different behaviors?

(Did someone say, "Show, not tell?" Shoot him. Or her.)
bb

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Bondi Beach

(Did someone say, "Show, not tell?" Shoot him. Or her.)

There's show (for good authors), tell (for inexperienced authors) and "dictate" for site owners (like Lazeez), Studio and Publishing execs, and Universe creators.

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@Crumbly Writer

Go on with the show for Ethel Merman, William Tell Overture for fans of the Lone Ranger, and dictators for potatoes (tators) named Dick.

taz40

@EazinAlong

A family playground for incest families. "Natural Love Resort" universe. I think it would be a big hit. I would have to agree, let the authors of the first few stories, come up with how they would enter the resort.
As for suggestions.
We all know that families are made up of all shape, sizes and types of personality. So this would be open to all walk of life.

EazinAlong

Thanks to everyone who's replied so far and for all of the great suggestions.

I'm favoring the creation of enclaves that would implement many of these suggestions. We'd begin with some obvious ones (family pool, dungeon, cougar lounge, etc.) but an author could create a new one as long as it was labeled accurately. Authors could then set their stories in the universe as they see fit.

There'd still be limits. And SOL TOS must be observed.

Still listening.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@EazinAlong

I'm favoring the creation of enclaves that would implement many of these suggestions. We'd begin with some obvious ones (family pool, dungeon, cougar lounge, etc.) but an author could create a new one as long as it was labeled accurately. Authors could then set their stories in the universe as they see fit.

For myself, I'd still go with separate resorts/islands (with a physical separation) just so one resort (say Incest Island) remains "family friendly" (i.e. visitors aren't confronted with things they don't approve of every time they turn around). Each visitor/group could invite people back to their rooms for whatever reason, but making it an acceptable practice raises questions of appropriateness.

I'd also include the Puppy Pound (for furries), the Castle (for S&M, since you need more room than just a solitary dungeon), the Ladies Room (for lesbians where men aren't allowed, but the activities are constantly broadcast to separate facilities for them), or the Stables (for ponies). The latter might never get written, since there's no big pony contingent on SOL, but a reference to it might be an intriguing tease.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

For myself, I'd still go with separate resorts/islands (with a physical separation) just so one resort (say Incest Island) remains


I agree.

I'd also include the Puppy Pound (for furries)


Could be for bestiality or BDSM pet play (where the submissive takes on the role of an annimal)

R/L Furry (as opposed to the artwork) is a form of cosplay (generally involves anthropomorphic animals, where as BDSM pet play usually restricts the sub to things an animal could normally do) covers a broad spectrum of animal types. Also from what I have read, very very few furry events are species specific. I would go with a less species specific name for the furry resort, Maybe something along the lines of Animal Kingdom (Zootopia being already taken).

Stables (for ponies)


For BDSM type pony girl type play or besiality involving horses, or were you thinking horse type furries, in which case, see my prior comment.

Maybe, The Petting Zoo for general (non BDSM involved) bestiality. I suggest this, because one attraction of such a resort, other than meeting like minded people would be the opportunity to try different kinds of animals, especially ones harder to acquire for personal use.

Potentially even predator species conditioned or genetically modified to see humans as sex rather than prey.

The Castle (or what ever the BDSM resort is called) should have facilities/events for other fetishes such as bestiality and pet play that get mixed in with and used in a BDSM context. I'm think here specifically of facilities like what is suggested above for the bestiality park + dog/horse/cat show style events for pet type subs.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer
Updated:

@Dominions Son


R/L Furry (as opposed to the artwork) is a form of cosplay (generally involves anthropomorphic animals, where as BDSM pet play usually restricts the sub to things an animal could normally do) covers a broad spectrum of animal types. Also from what I have read, very very few furry events are species specific. I would go with a less species specific name for the furry resort, Maybe something along the lines of Animal Kingdom (Zootopia being already taken).


I'd actually thought of "Puppy Pound" as being a broad category (including all animal categories, real or imagined). Perhaps a better name would be "Peter's Pet Shop", where all the tiny peters come out to play!

And then there's the Cuckold's Corner, where men bring their wives to watch them get fucked by other men while the men abuse the men for putting up with it. Maybe a "Pissing Pool" for water sports or a variation on Cuckold's Corner (for all the women who discover late in life that they're still lesbians but who still appreciate dicks) the Lesbian Liaison, where women bring their old partners to watch them get fucked (and enjoy it for a change) by new lesbian partners and an approving crowd. It could be 'life-changing' for at least one part of those attending.

Rather than "Petting Zoo", which sadly doesn't begin with the same letters or even rhythm, I'd suggest "Animal Park". "Puppy Pound" sound playful, which is basically what furies do (and yes, many of them do engage in costumed sex during their conventions). Likewise, "Animal Park" brings up the idea of a variety of animals all meeting and playing together, but it's got a more 'real world' connection to it (less fantasy, more reality).

The possibilities are endless. The difficulty is picking where to begin, and then drawing the lines on future offshoots. As with most fiction, the rules of the universe need to be established early so readers don't feel like the rugs been pulled from under them when the universe suddenly goes in an entirely new direction with entirely different rules.

Replies:   Dominions Son
richardshagrin

Not all activity needs to be limited to one subsection of the overall park. For example, Pony Play (ponygirls pulling carts) can be used to provide transportation from parking or arrival areas to various sub parks.

Replies:   Bondi Beach
Bondi Beach

@richardshagrin

For example, Pony Play (ponygirls pulling carts) can be used to provide transportation from parking or arrival areas to various sub parks.


And of course during the ride the visitor could take a break and ride the ponygirl, I suppose.

bb

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@Bondi Beach

Visitors with those ambitions will need to unharness and remove tail and bit and persuade the pony to play. Then harnessing and preparing the pony again will take some knowledge and time. I wouldn't count on being welcomed in that activity. Of course authors get to make decisions that fit their plot. Unless there is a Pony stable, racetrack and an author who recruits (enslaves) ponygirls and handles their sub area of the park. Then you need his (or her, possibly) permission. I suggest approaching other passengers, or ones arriving at your subpark before they are processed. Potential sex partners once they get in your area might well be interested before getting registered.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

I'd actually thought of "Puppy Pound" as being a broad category (including all animal categories, real or imagined). Perhaps a better name would be "Peter's Pet Shop", where all the tiny peters come out to play!


Again, most furries would probably be squicked by real bestiality which is why I suggest some separation.

Replies:   EazinAlong
EazinAlong
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer

Those are all great suggestions.

I'm still pondering enclaves vs. islands. Trying to make sideways mobility possible ... the family that wants to explore daughter-puppy love would be one of my faves. But it might work with islands. Many thanks.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
EazinAlong

I'm choosing not to reply to individual suggestions, but I think you're getting my concept. That's all I can hope for.

I have quite a few ideas of my own that existed before I floated this here. I'll begin writing one. I have a significant commitment on May 5 (tomorrow, as I write this) that ends my season of big commitments until September. :-) In other words, I'll have time to write.

I'll also be working on an overall description of the Universe and probably share a draft here first.

Still Listening.

EazinAlong

@Dominions Son

I've always sort of favored "The Kennel" or "The Barn" as generic monikers for such facilities, but those are just ideas.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@EazinAlong

"The Kennel" works for a K9 bestiality facility. "The
Barn" works for a facility featuring livestock. My idea for the "The Petting Zoo" covers a broader range of animal species including ones that most people will only ever see in a zoo.

Crumbly Writer
Updated:

@EazinAlong


I'm still pondering enclaves vs. islands. Trying to make sideways mobility possible ... the family that wants to explore daughter-puppy love would be one of my faves. But it might work with islands. Many thanks.


That depends more on physical locations. If you locate it in the Philipines or Asia, it would be rocky mountain islands. If it's in the Caribbean, it'll more likely be enclaves as there aren't that many islands left to develop anymore.

@DS

"The Kennel" works for a K9 bestiality facility. "The Barn" works for a facility featuring livestock. My idea for the "The Petting Zoo" covers a broader range of animal species including ones that most people will only ever see in a zoo.


You need to decide if this is fantasy or science fiction when making these decisions. If it's sci-fi, you can make the animals do whatever you want (with the limits of your universe), but if it's a romantic/sexual fantasy, I'd dial it back to avoid unbelievable acts by the animals and the threat of legal action if a participant gets mauled.

On the other hand "Kennel", "Barn" and "Petting Zoo" aren't exactly erotic/romantic images. "Puppy Pound", while not strictly accurate since it would include other animals, is more warm and fuzzy, promising something cute and cuddly.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

If it's sci-fi, you can make the animals do whatever you want (with the limits of your universe), but if it's a romantic/sexual fantasy, I'd dial it back to avoid unbelievable acts by the animals and the threat of legal action if a participant gets mauled.


People have been killed in real life trying to have sex with horses, due to rupturing and tearing of internal organs. That doesn't seem to put much of a damper on human/horse bestiality porn for the niche that looks for that sort of thing.

As long as it's just a matter of somewhat unnatural sexual behavior towards humans without funky anatomy or unnatural intelligence, I don't see it as that much of an issue.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Dominions Son

As long as it's just a matter of somewhat unnatural sexual behavior towards humans without funky anatomy or unnatural intelligence, I don't see it as that much of an issue.

The issue isn't how stupid people can be, but the legal ramifications if a company was responsible for someone being killed. Despite where it happened, they'd be driven out of business in no time.

I just can't see a for-profit company risking mixing customers with wild animals. Pets are another matter. It's even possible they'd risk allowing humans and horses, but definitely not humans and tigers, wolves or bears.

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer

My Niece went to Thailand and petted a tiger and spent time riding an elephant. I saw pictures. About ten years ago my wife went to Africa and petted a leopard. Again there are pictures to prove it. I strongly suspect the people who arranged it did it for profit. Of course the legal situation is different outside the first world.

I have also heard of people swimming with dolphins and sometimes scuba diving or snorkeling in waters with sharks or other dangerous/poisonous sealife. Jellyfish can be hazardous while swimming in the ocean, US beaches allow swimming.

sejintenej

@richardshagrin

I have also heard of people swimming with dolphins and sometimes scuba diving or snorkeling in waters with sharks or other dangerous/poisonous sealife. Jellyfish can be hazardous while swimming in the ocean, US beaches allow swimming.

As do European countries. Where I was brought up a popular tourist sandy beach had weaver fish in six inches of water close to where we fished for conger all the time. Both are very very nasty if you get on the wrong "foot". Others to be afraid of there are deep sea crabs with shells up to a foot across, lobsters, Portuguese Men of War (that's a hospital jobbie) as are the onshore adders.
Life is full of unavoidable dangers as even Hearst discovered.

Crumbly Writer

@richardshagrin

My Niece went to Thailand and petted a tiger and spent time riding an elephant. I saw pictures. About ten years ago my wife went to Africa and petted a leopard. Again there are pictures to prove it. I strongly suspect the people who arranged it did it for profit. Of course the legal situation is different outside the first world.

Believe me, there's a world of difference between petting a domesticated tiger and having sex with one. Many animals are neutered, because they're unpredictable over overly aggressive when not spade. Even if they don't bite, those claws can do a world of damage if they poke out at the wrong time during sex. Need I also mention that tigers bite their partner's necks during sex?

@richardshagrin
I've swum with poisonous jelly fish (with 30' tentacles), but that's because the wind blows them into the beach (i.e. it's a 'non-controllable event'). I used to surf in Rhode Island, and I'd play with Portuguese Men of War (is that "Men of War" or "Man of Wars"?) as they blew in. Since they tenticles trail straight behind them, it was (relatively) safe, but those same jelly fish would often send someone to the hospital when they washed up on shore and some kid stepped on it.

People have also been known to have sex with dolphins, though never for profit. Though wild, they're a more 'domestic' species (i.e. friendly and watchful of humans) than are lions, tigers and bears.

If you want to include tiger sex, it's fiction, so go ahead. I never said you couldn't. What I suggested was that you decide whether you're writing a sexual fantasy piece, a fantasy (imaginary world) or a science-fiction story. How you write the story will be different in each case. You can also have the animals declawed and their fangs filed down, just don't let word get out, as those actions are frowned on by most animal rights organizations.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

Many animals are neutered, because they're unpredictable over overly aggressive when not spade


That would be spayed. Spayed only applies to female animals and is rarely done for animals other than cats and dogs.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

You can also have the animals declawed and their fangs filed down, just don't let word get out, as those actions are frowned on by most animal rights organizations.


There is also simple Pavlovian conditioning to associate humans with sex rather than food or danger. If sex with animals were legal, there is no reason that this couldn't be done within existing technology.

Many animals are neutered, because they're unpredictable over overly aggressive


That aggression is generally focused on those seen as sexual rivals. So once conditioned to see humans as sex, a male animal would be far more of a threat to a human male than a human female.

Yes, some animal's natural mating practices would be too rough for humans and could cause sever injuries, but we've already discounted that in the case of horses.

Some of those threats could be dealt with using existing technology on the human end. For example Kevlar body suits. Wouldn't be enough if the animal was trying to kill you, but would potentially be enough for sex.

richardshagrin

@Dominions Son

Male cattle (bulls) are converted to steers frequently. The result is sometimes called rocky mountain oysters. Stallions are turned to geldings to be easier to control. Excess males are often converted to food. A flock of hens usually only need one rooster. Humans in the more distant past castrated males. Eunuchs were used in harems so they wouldn't impregnate the wives and concubines of sultans. Also castrati were used in choirs as singers since their voices didn't change as they matured.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@richardshagrin

Male cattle (bulls) are converted to steers frequently. The result is sometimes called rocky mountain oysters. Stallions are turned to geldings to be easier to control.


Yes, castrating male animals is done in almost all domesticated species to control breading.

However, spaying females is only generally done (there are a few individual (not species) exceptions) in cats and dogs. This is because female cats and dogs have a much higher risk of of mammary or cervical/uterine cancer than other domestic species.

Crumbly Writer

@Dominions Son

That would be spayed. Spayed only applies to female animals and is rarely done for animals other than cats and dogs.

I was thinking bores, which--unless cut--continue to grow, growing meaner and nastier all the time. This overabundance of adrenaline doesn't affect all animals, but for those it does, it makes them unlikely to intermix with humans with careful supervision. On the other hand, with rutting animals, as long as there's no rutting females nearby there's no issue.

DS, doing research for a story, I discovered some disturbing facts about uncastrated bores. Few farmers are willing to deal with them, so a few rangers specialize in bores, spending much of their time dealing with just them. They'll attack virtually anyone who gets near them, whether they'd competitors or not. Once the (the bores) get too large to mate (the females collapse under their weight), they're killed because there's no longer sufficient justification for dealing with their behavior. That's way there are so few bores on farms. In the forests, it's usually not the females with babies which attack, but the male bores rushing at anything which crosses them.

Some of those threats could be dealt with using existing technology on the human end. For example Kevlar body suits. Wouldn't be enough if the animal was trying to kill you, but would potentially be enough for sex.

The most common technology are cotton socks when performing human/canine sex (those nails can scratch!).

@DS

That's an entirely different rationale. I misused the term "spaying". I meant "castration" since I was referring to reducing aggressiveness in males (something state governments in the South (U.S.) did with black males on occasion).

Replies:   Dominions Son  Capt Zapp
Dominions Son
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer


I discovered some disturbing facts about uncastrated bores. Few farmers are willing to deal with them, so a few rangers specialize in bores, spending much of their time dealing with just them.


That's interesting. I don't think there is any other species like that. I wonder where it comes from, if it's a result of too much human meddling in their gene pool.

From what I've read/seen on TV programs on the feral hog problem, feral hogs travel in family groups with mixed genders, so I would think free breeding at least puts a damper on that trait.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Dominions Son

feral hogs travel in family groups with mixed genders


CW,

that's true for the great majority of them. But there are some single old boars out on their own because they're just too ornery to get on with anyone or anything. Despite being a damn small percentage of the wild boar population they cause about 90% of the reported problems and attacks.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater

But there are some single old boars out on their own because they're just too ornery to get on with anyone or anything.


It might not just be age. There might be a recessive trait that will still show up occasionally in the free breeding feral hogs that has become endemic in the captive bred population. Feral hogs are generally smaller and hairier than free breeding feral hogs, to a genetic trait is not that far fetched.

Ernest Bywater

@Dominions Son

It might not just be age.


That may be true. What I'm going on is the various reports and surveys on wild and feral pigs which show the majority are family groups that will only cause trouble and attack when they or the young are threatened, and the majority of hostile wild pigs are males living outside the family groups, and most are older animals. The underlying cause wasn't in any of the reports I've seen anywhere, but there are many reports from different countries that make it clear the problem pigs are almost always single rouge males.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Capt Zapp

@Crumbly Writer

...disturbing facts about uncastrated bores.


Yes, there are too many boring people as it is. Help stop them from breeding! ;)

Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater

What I'm going on is the various reports and surveys on wild and feral pigs which show the majority are family groups that will only cause trouble and attack when they or the young are threatened, and the majority of hostile wild pigs are males living outside the family groups, and most are older animals.


They may only attack people when threatened, but from what I have read, they do cause a lot of property damage.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
richardshagrin

Bores are boring people. Boars are male pigs.

Ernest Bywater

@Dominions Son

they do cause a lot of property damage.


so do any group of animals while searching for food - you should see what a mob of kangaroos can do to a property or crop without trying.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater

so do any group of animals while searching for food


No, actually, most don't do that kind of damage. As for kangaroos, we don't have roving packs (or is it herds) of kangaroos in the US, we do have a lot of feral hogs in the south western part of the country.

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@Dominions Son

I thought the razorbacks were in Arkansas, not Texas and further west. Perhaps our ideas of the south western part of the country are different. Feral hogs and desert are not often observed together.

Ernest Bywater

@richardshagrin

Feral hogs and desert are not often observed together.


Unless them feral hogs are elected to government positions!

Dominions Son

@richardshagrin

Feral hogs and desert are not often observed together.


Not true. Though, I was wrong. The feral hog problem extends across the entire southern US from coast to coast.

http://cdn.wideopenspaces.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/wild-pig-map.jpg

sejintenej

@Dominions Son

It might not just be age. There might be a recessive trait that will still show up occasionally in the free breeding feral hogs that has become endemic in the captive bred population. Feral hogs are generally smaller and hairier than free breeding feral hogs, to a genetic trait is not that far fetched.

Local thought is that pigs go feral in a single generation - quicker than other animal species. I don't know about tame pigs but wild boar go to 50kg of muscle commonly and anything can set them off. Approaching a family group is asking for trouble. Because of the danger local licencing law requires a certain number (I think eight) of qualified armed hunters in any wild boar hunt

Replies:   Dominions Son
Crumbly Writer
Updated:

They're also not restricted to deserts, though they prefer hot climates. They're often found in southern (hot) forested areas where they can hide and root around to their hearts content. Local farmers allow my brother to hunt all the wild pig, bear and turkey my brother wants to clear out their farms of the critters eating their product and damaging their property (they're the only animals there's a legal hunting season for).

Just for your info, domesticated boars have no upward growth potential, and must use their tusks continually, otherwise they're grow into their heads. Feral pigs (not of domestic stock), tend to be smaller and don't have the same unlimited growth. They also don't live as long, due to their increased feeding demands and pampered existence. Plus, as I mentioned, owners frequently put them down rather than dealing with their overly-aggressive behaviors. They're a labor intensive cash bonanza, but once they outlive their benefit (by growing too large to successfully breed) they're taken out to reduce overhead. They're also too tough and 'gamey' to render as food.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@sejintenej

Approaching a family group is asking for trouble.


Yes, but that is nothing like the indiscriminate aggression that CW was describing as being a problem in domestic boars. If the feral hogs were that aggressive, you couldn't have mature boars in a family group because they would be constantly attacking the other hogs.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Dominions Son

Yes, but that is nothing like the indiscriminate aggression that CW was describing as being a problem in domestic boars. If the feral hogs were that aggressive, you couldn't have mature boars in a family group because they would be constantly attacking the other hogs.

I suspect it's a matter of keeping a more constant and controlled watch over the boar species, thus the wild feral pigs are more abundant, while the domesticated boars aren't as likely to escape. But my research on the matter was limited to my story, so I'm not as up-to-date on the feral boar populations.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

Feral pigs (not of domestic stock), tend to be smaller and don't have the same unlimited growth.


Feral pigs come from domestic stock by definition. That's what Feral means, domesticated animals that have reverted to a wild state. If they weren't from domestic stock, they would just be wild pigs. That's why you never hear tigers, lynx, bobcats or cougars being referred to as feral cats, because they were never domesticated.

Crumbly Writer

@Dominions Son

Feral pigs come from domestic stock by definition. That's what Feral means, domesticated animals that have reverted to a wild state. If they weren't from domestic stock, they would just be wild pigs. That's why you never hear tigers, lynx, bobcats or cougars being referred to as feral cats, because they were never domesticated.

In that case, I'm not sure about the size discrepancies. I was under the impression they were distinct species: wild pigs vs. domesticated stock. The difference in growth might be due to a combination of feed and drugs (antibiotic use) which unlocks the 'unlimited growth' potential of the boars. Farm stock are traditionally (since they began using antibiotics as a growth element) bigger than feral. Except in more exotic locations, I've never heard of 800# or heavier feral pigs.

Dominions Son
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer


In that case, I'm not sure about the size discrepancies.


The feral pigs are actually a mix of several different breeds of domestic pigs. The size discrepancy can be explained by free breeding vs controlled breeding.

Domestic dogs come in all sizes from a couple of pounds to a couple hundred pounds depending on breed. However, free breeding feral domestic dogs world wide all look about the same no matter what breeds initially went into forming the feral population: med sized (around 20-30 pounds), short fur, curly tail.

Don't forget, regardless of breed all domestic dogs are considered a single species. The same is true for domestic pigs from Vietnamese Pot Belly (relatively small) to whatever breed the US pork industry currently favors (massive).

ETA:

This also holds true for feral cats. A free breeding population will lose all distinctive breed characteristics in just a couple of generations.

2nd ETA:

The reason for this is simple. The genes that control the well known traits of iconic breeds turn out to be recessive in a free breeding population.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

I've never heard of 800# or heavier feral pigs.


Feral pigs up to 1000 # have been taken by hunters and confirmed, although these specimens usually turn out to be a first gen mix of full domestic and feral hogs. Google Hogzilla.

Crumbly Writer

How did we go from story ideas for a Natural Love Resort to discussing the intricacies of wild pigs? While pig lore is interesting (mildly), I'd prefer discussing creating/reading/finding stories.

Replies:   Dominions Son
tppm

@Dominions Son

It's also done to humans, where it's called radical hysterectomy (removal of uterus, Fallopian tubes, and ovaries, leaving only the vulva and vagina).

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@tppm

It's also done to humans, where it's called radical hysterectomy (removal of uterus, Fallopian tubes, and ovaries, leaving only the vulva and vagina).


True, but very rarely as a preventative measure.

They generally prefer to spay dogs and cats before their first heat if they aren't going to be bred. Mammary cancer risk increases significantly the more estrus cycles the animal goes through before being spayed.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

How did we go from story ideas for a Natural Love Resort to discussing the intricacies of wild pigs?


Look in the damn mirror. You're the one who objected to including exotic animals and you're the one who brought up the issue of the indiscriminate aggressiveness in domestic boars.

Capt Zapp

@Dominions Son

True, but very rarely as a preventative measure.


Sounds like a good way to shut down welfare baby factories.

Replies:   tppm
Crumbly Writer

@Dominions Son

They generally prefer to spay dogs and cats before their first heat if they aren't going to be bred. Mammary cancer risk increases significantly the more estrus cycles the animal goes through before being spayed.

That why, with human (according to the newest theories), pregnancies reduce the chances of those cancers by interrupting the normal estrogen cycles.

tppm

@Capt Zapp

Sounds like a good way to shut down welfare baby factories.


Many politicians thought so too, till some guy in Germany gave eugenics a bad name.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@tppm

Many politicians thought so too, till some guy in Germany gave eugenics a bad name.


Sigmund Freud?

Replies:   richardshagrin
richardshagrin

@Dominions Son

I think he was from Austria.

sejintenej

@Dominions Son

Feral pigs (not of domestic stock), tend to be smaller and don't have the same unlimited growth.

Feral pigs come from domestic stock by definition. That's what Feral means, domesticated animals that have reverted to a wild state. If they weren't from domestic stock, they would just be wild pigs. That's why you never hear tigers, lynx, bobcats or cougars being referred to as feral cats, because they were never domesticated.

Some of our wild boar (sanglier) have tusks which I have never heard of in domesticated pigs. Also, around here, 50kg is a good weight for a wild boar. Those I have seen (and I have them on this farm) are all much smaller than UK domesticated,bred and raised pigs I have seen.

I am starting to wonder whether wild boar in different areas come from different porcine stock which could account for regional differences.

Ernest Bywater

@sejintenej

I am starting to wonder whether wild boar in different areas come from different porcine stock which could account for regional differences.


Correct, and many breeds have tusks, it's just the breeds used for domestic breeding are ones without tusks.

Dominions Son

@sejintenej

I am starting to wonder whether wild boar in different areas come from different porcine stock which could account for regional differences.


Possible, but then the UK and Europe also have native true wild hogs. North America does not, we only have feral hogs.

Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

Correct, and many breeds have tusks, it's just the breeds used for domestic breeding are ones without tusks.

Speaking of thread drift ... for those of you into time-travel or do-over stories, pork used to be the staple food, simply because if properly prepared, it could be shipped across the country without perishing. In the 19th and early 20th century, the only fruit commonly eaten were apples because they shipped well. I'd always wondered how the tasteless Iceberg Lettuce became such a U.S. staple until reading that it's the slowest to spoil, especially when left as a head and only peeling off the outermost leaves.

Replies:   Dominions Son
Dominions Son

@Ernest Bywater


Correct, and many breeds have tusks, it's just the breeds used for domestic breeding are ones without tusks.


US feral hogs also have tusks, though on the small side compared to true Wild hogs from Europe and Asia.

The no tusks thing is likely another one of those things that is likely a normally recessive trait that is only maintainable by controlled breeding and will vanish even from domestic stock if they are allowed to breed freely.

Dominions Son

@Crumbly Writer

Speaking of thread drift ... for those of you into time-travel or do-over stories, pork used to be the staple food, simply because if properly prepared, it could be shipped across the country without perishing.


A cured whole ham, uncut, will keep for up to a year without being refrigerated. The quality will degrade as the meat dries out, especially towards the outside, but it will still be safe to eat.

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