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Parenthood Stories

Crumbly Writer

I'm still mystified about this site. It doesn't seem to have a large following (based only on the number of posts), and it doesn't quite seem to match the natures of SOL and FS (though I can see it providing story alternatives and bringing in new readers).

Does anyone here post to this site, or does it draw an entirely new collection of authors? The site seems split between fiction, non-fiction and essay, rather than the primarily fiction nature of both SOL and FS (how many blog/essay sites do we really need?).

Does the site bring in many readers? Is there any crossover readers between Parentstories, FS and/or SOL? Is it just slow to attract new readers (like FS) or is it just a limited-use site? Does anyone here read anything on the site?

I'm trying to figure out just which niche it fills. I can see parents wanting a story site, but I suspect the premise would be better served by a parents' magazine/website, or even a baby-name website.

Ernest Bywater

@Crumbly Writer

I think it's dedicated to, and looking for, a type and style of story very different to what most of the SoL and FS authors write. All that means is there's little, if any, crossover between them. That being the case, it's taking a lot of time to get anywhere.

There's a large number of stories at SoL that would suit FS, but only a small percentage of the authors have thought , or bothered to, make the crossover and post to both. PS has the same issue, but to a major larger extent.

Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I think it's dedicated to, and looking for, a type and style of story very different to what most of the SoL and FS authors write. All that means is there's little, if any, crossover between them. That being the case, it's taking a lot of time to get anywhere.

I can see wanting to increase the sites' base, but while FS's clients may move to SOL as they age, and it gives SOL's clients another access when they're using someone else machine, I'm just not sure the PS site really buys Lazeez much for the amount of effort involved.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Crumbly Writer

I'm just not sure the PS site really buys Lazeez much for the amount of effort involved.


I'm not sure, either, but that's his decision and he probably has some reason for it.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I'm not sure, either, but that's his decision and he probably has some reason for it.

Personally, rather than trying for such small groups (how many parents of young children have time to read adult stories about children anyway?), I'd think he'd get more bang-for-the-buck by hosting a 'gay SOL' site. Gay's are more active readers, and they're loyal, supporting each other more than those who can go anywhere for their entertainment. Since so many feel uncomfortable on SOL, I'd think creating a separate site where they're somewhat sheltered from the judgement of conservative readers would be a draw (especially because many of the other gay porn sites feature such low-quality works).

Replies:   tppm
Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Crumbly Writer

Does anyone here post to this site, or does it draw an entirely new collection of authors?


It's basically a dead site. It was an attempt at a niche site, and it obviously failed.

The current plan is to simply move the stories to FS and shutter the site.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
tppm

@Crumbly Writer

Is PS an "adult" (i.e. has sexual content) story site? I've wondered that since it was announced. I doubt it, because I looked at it shortly after it opened and didn't see anything like age restrictions or the like.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@tppm


Is PS an "adult" (i.e. has sexual content) story site?


Actually, I don't think it is an adult site. Check these links

http://parenthoodstories.com/docs/code_faq.php

http://parenthoodstories.com/author/posting_guidelines.php

quote

Stories may not contain explicit sex; and must not have a sex theme, revolves around nudity or sex in general.

Stories may not contain foul language. Some words my be mildly censored.


end quote

Crumbly Writer

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

It's basically a dead site. It was an attempt at a niche site, and it obviously failed.

The current plan is to simply move the stories to FS and shutter the site.

That's too bad. It might help to add a tag/genre category of "Parents" or "Kids" to accommodate the authors who contributed to the site.

I can see an interest in such a site, as the number of articles and books on parenting demonstrate, but I never thought you actually had an 'in' on the market. Most parents would use sites they're already familiar with, and likely wouldn't invest much time during visits.

graybyrd

@Ernest Bywater

There's a large number of stories at SoL that would suit FS, but only a small percentage of the authors have thought , or bothered to, make the crossover and post to both.


Which is a shame, really, for those authors whose work would be best featured on Finestories and not buried in the avalanche of crude stroke-oriented offal that SOL suffers. A bit more promotion of FS on the SOL site would help. It's a rare luxury to have both, so here's hoping FS grows and prospers.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Ernest Bywater

There's a large number of stories at SoL that would suit FS, but only a small percentage of the authors have thought , or bothered to, make the crossover and post to both.


For a while now, I've been thinking about automatically displaying SOL no-sex stories on FS. It will require redoing a lot of things. But in my head, it's a firm future plan.

Ernest Bywater

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

For a while now, I've been thinking about automatically displaying SOL no-sex stories on FS. It will require redoing a lot of things. But in my head, it's a firm future plan.


As long as it's a case of displaying them on both, I doubt anyone will be upset. I know a few authors don't do it because it means they have to upload the stories twice and they're lazy, but if you do the work I'm sure they'll agree. You suggestion also gets the stories from the retired authors on FS as well. Overall, I see it as a win-win situation.

I like FS because I can tell people about both sites and then let them get a taste of the stories by going to FS while at work, while SoL is blocked to them at work.

Crumbly Writer

@graybyrd

Which is a shame, really, for those authors whose work would be best featured on Finestories and not buried in the avalanche of crude stroke-oriented offal that SOL suffers. A bit more promotion of FS on the SOL site would help. It's a rare luxury to have both, so here's hoping FS grows and prospers.

I make a point of posting to FS first, when the story allows it, in hopes of giving the regular readers an impetus to check out the site more often. Hopefully, if the authors provide the material, the readers will follow. "Write it, and they will come." That's the theory, anyway.

Replies:   graybyrd
richardshagrin

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

One more reason to get more readers from SOL to Fine Stories: Its a preview of the benefits of a Premier Membership. At least there are lots of interesting add-ons to stories on the Fine Stories site, like similar stories, more data on when a chapter was posted, various options for setting up libraries and some other things I probably haven't explored.

If my budget could afford it I would spend the money. There are stories for Premier members only on SOL I'd like to read. Lubrican, especially. My spell check is not real smart. It wants me to spell Lubrican as Lubricant. There might be some kind of joke in this mess, like Jay Can't rell or Can trell. Or a can of Lubri. Stop me before I post again.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@richardshagrin

Its a preview of the benefits of a Premier Membership. At least there are lots of interesting add-ons to stories on the Fine Stories site, like similar stories, more data on when a chapter was posted, various options for setting up libraries and some other things I probably haven't explored.

I figured offering stories on FS first was a 'low-cost' alternative to offering them (on SOL) as "Premier reads", where'd they'd get fewer downloads. Most reads still come from posting to SOL, but I like to spread the material around across several sites to appeal to a wider market.

graybyrd

@Crumbly Writer

I make a point of posting to FS first, when the story allows it, in hopes of giving the regular readers an impetus to check out the site more often. Hopefully, if the authors provide the material, the readers will follow. "Write it, and they will come." That's the theory, anyway.


Yes, I agree. That Field of Dreams thing. I post on FS first, to encourage readership there; then I follow on SOL some days later. Also, my chapters on FS have a considerable lead on the SOL count ... so if (hopefully) someone wants to stay current with the serial, they'll be ahead by staying with FS.

As for Lazeez's thought of auto-posting all non-sex SOL stories across to FS... verrrrry interesting!

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@graybyrd

As for Lazeez's thought of auto-posting all non-sex SOL stories across to FS... verrrrry interesting!

While it's interesting, it short of short circuits our (the authors') attempts to promote the site by offering material there first (I'm not sure if it's bidirectional or not). However, it'll help to boost FS's content, which is the greatest driver in attracting new readers to the site, so I'm not sure whether Lazeez really has much choice.

Replies:   ustourist
ustourist

@Crumbly Writer

It may actually boost the number of authors posting on FS first.
Assuming the plan would be to migrate the older 'no sex' stories initially, authors may then start to receive feedback from new readers there and begin posting on FS.
If a system could be built in offering a time lapse (either way) between posting on the two sites for all new qualifying stories, then the potential increased feedback for the authors, both as beta readers and for fine tuning to a particular marketplace, could be quite beneficial. The SOL readership already seems to have a reputation for constructive feedback when compared to other sites, and I would expect that those visiting a non sex stories site would fall more into that category.
The only drawback I can see would be the potential for more authors to use this as a beta site prior to publication and then pull the story once they have had free editorial advice. I think Lazeez may have to have a minimum site exposure time or something to avoid the 'hit and run' approach of those mercenary types.

Crumbly Writer

I suspect Lazeez's biggest dilemma is one of timing. Do you post everything on SOL to FS, and if so, how do you avoid duplicating stories? Or do you build in a time delay (posting to one site first), and then have authors post before the automated system does.

It would require some advanced planning. However, I'm not convinced there are a lot of authors who post to the two sites at different times, while there's a fair amount who already post to both.

Also, I tend to modify my stories before posting them to FS in order to change certain elements (say, by deemphasizing certain scenes or rephasing curses so readers understand what's happening without the missing scenes).

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

I post to both SoL and FS at the same time because there are some readers on FS only and some on SoL only, with some on both. I've had some readers email me saying they read the FS posted story at work and recommend it to friends, and read the same story on SoL at home. How often that happens is anyone's guess.

Due to the different readership groups I prefer to post to both sites.

I think Lazeez would be best to slowly copy the No Sex stories across to FS if they aren't already there.

From a mechanics point of view, I'd love it if the SoL Posting Wizard and a tick-box labelled Also Post the story to Fine Stories which only becomes active if the No Sex option is selected. When the FS option is activated then the Age Group option comes up. This will leave it as the author's choice to double post while making it a lot easier to post to both. The only thing is it will require a bit of work to get the Genre and tag options aligned properly because there are some differences between them, other than the sex related ones.

Ernest Bywater
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer


I tend to modify my stories before posting them to FS in order to change certain elements


I post the exact same story to both, because what i write either fits FS or it doesn't and that's the decider for posting there.

edit to add: I also tend to go with a mid teen age group for the stories with a lot of violence, just to be safe. Let the parents decide if they'll let their younger children read it.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer  graybyrd
Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I post the exact same story to both, because what i write either fits FS or it doesn't and that's the decider for posting there.

I also tend to go with a mid-teen age group for the stories with a lot of violence, just to be safe.

My no-sex stories tend to be more geared towards adult readers (at least high school), so they often contain inappropriate language. I'm also preparing two copies of a new story, the SOL version with sex scenes, and the FS one which implies but doesn't describe the sex scenes, so the readers can follow what's happening since the sexual relations advance the story.

The FS conversion tool is good at cleaning up curse words, disguising them but leaving it plain what was intended (so readers don't have to guess), but sometimes it's better to rephrase, rather than disguise language.

graybyrd
Updated:

@Ernest Bywater


edit to add: I also tend to go with a mid teen age group for the stories with a lot of violence, just to be safe. Let the parents decide if they'll let their younger children read it.


(I've deleted my response here, and used it to start a new thread to avoid thread drift.)

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@graybyrd

Thread drift is like working in the sea. It's a vital, natural environment full of life, vitality, hope and terror mixed into one, but it never stays still. Instead, you're constantly buffeted by currents. The main one draws you away from your starting point, so you have to constantly reorient yourself, while another pulls you into the crashing shorebreak, and the more threatening rip tides seek to yank you into water too keep to swim back again.

The only discussion which don't drift, are those where there's no progress, like the whole "he said" discussion (as opposed to the "said he" vs. "he said" discussion, which reoriented the misplaced discussion).

Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

@Ernest Bywater

I think Lazeez would be best to slowly copy the No Sex stories across to FS if they aren't already there.


For now, the idea that's being formed in my head is to build a story specific document server that all the stories get uploaded to and it serves any number of sites.

So when that is ready and the sites' engine is ready to handle it, all the stories from SOL and FS will be fed into that server, properly tagged and the sites each will pull all suitable stories from it.

So there would be no gradual posting of stories, at one point the no-sex stories will simply appear on FS with their dates preserved.

That may mess with some of the things you guys are doing to accommodate FS and I'll be sure to consult here when the time comes to see what can be done, and if there is anything that needs to be done to make the system work.

The whole design hasn't yet crystallized in my head. Maybe the story management page will have check boxes for each site to make it show the story or not. We'll see.

Ernest Bywater

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

That may mess with some of the things you guys are doing to accommodate FS


I like the idea of the one story database serving both sites. I post the same story to both sites, so the only issue will be merging the story statistics and the author statics (which should be fairly simply if you do the same thing of one author database as well.

The only real issue will be sorting out the genres and tags because there are some tags on one site that are genres on the other. I think you need to get them the same as far as what's on FS is presented the same with the same meaning on SoL. That will make that part of it easy.

Crumbly Writer

@Lazeez Jiddan (Webmaster)

That may mess with some of the things you guys are doing to accommodate FS and I'll be sure to consult here when the time comes to see what can be done, and if there is anything that needs to be done to make the system work.

Don't worry, if you move everything over to FS, we can simply elect to make them Premiere stories (if you can select them for one site and not another).

Will you allow an 'opt-in' for each site. Say, if I want to change the story for inclusion to one site, can I prevent it from being posted until I post the other version, or will both version be copied to both locations?

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Crumbly Writer

Will you allow an 'opt-in' for each site. Say, if I want to change the story for inclusion to one site, can I prevent it from being posted until I post the other version, or will both version be copied to both locations?


I think it should be easy to have a slight difference to the title and just use a tag for the SoL story that isn't good for the FS story

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I think it should be easy to have a slight difference to the title and just use a tag for the SoL story that isn't good for the FS story

Would that mean, if I do separate versions for SOL and FS, that I'd then have two separate versions of the same story on SOL? Also, would the two site retain their separate voting systems, or would the two sites merge their votes?

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
graybyrd

Welcome, Chaos! Hello there, Confusion! So nice to have you back here again.

Ernest Bywater

@Crumbly Writer

Would that mean, if I do separate versions for SOL and FS, that I'd then have two separate versions of the same story on SOL?


CW,
Earlier you said you cleaned up the story to make it FS suitable, well that means two stories. I would expect if you continued to do as you do you the situation will be the same as it is. A lot will depend on how Lazeez sets it up, but I think what will happen is initially anything that's FS compatible will be given an FS tag, after that I expect the author will have a check box where you list what site/s you want the story to be on, but the ability to tick for FS will be unavailable until you tick the No Sex box. - Well, that's how I'd design it, but Lazeez has done more database and data entry screen design work than I have, and more recently, too.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Ernest Bywater

I expect the author will have a check box where you list what site/s you want the story to be on, but the ability to tick for FS will be unavailable until you tick the No Sex box.

My impression (and at this point, that's all it is, an 'impression') is that he'll make all the non-sex books available to FS across the board (in order to capitalize on the thousands (?) of stories posted over the years). If he employed a simple check box, he'd have trouble posting older stories for which the authors are no longer available.

Replies:   Ernest Bywater
Ernest Bywater

@Crumbly Writer

he'll make all the non-sex books available to FS across the board


There's two aspects, one that I covered in my previous post is about the posting of new stories. As to making the old stories available, I expect it will be a simple case of making all the old stories available. But I also expect Lazeez will check with current authors for where there are duplicate stories from the existing database. We'll just have to wait and see.

Replies:   Capt Zapp
Capt Zapp

@Ernest Bywater

Another possibility is that he makes all current 'no-sex' stories available on FS and having a check-box for new submissions.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Capt Zapp

Another possibility is that he makes all current 'no-sex' stories available on FS and having a check-box for new submissions.

I'd prefer an 'opt out' mechanism on any story. If I prepare two different versions of a story, years ago, I don't want both versions competing with each other. However, it should be up to me, the author, to eliminate the incorrect one for a given site.

Note: My comments about 'different versions' for no-sex stories is based upon a new book I'm working on, where the basic plotline is based on a pseudo incestuous relationship. Even with the non-sexual storyline, it's essential the readers understand what's going on, even if I don't SHOW it happening. (The idea being, the individuals aren't related, but were adopted by the same couple who sought to control their lives in an effort to make them normal.) With my currently posting no-sex story, I'm also changing the wording in specific chapters to replace word substitutions with more descriptive (more Shakperean) curses.

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