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{notice}

Switch Blayde

I have the following in the front of a story I'm writing.

{notice}

{4}WARNING

Characters in this story use the N-word. It's needed for the plot and to make the characters believable. It's not intended to offend anyone in real life.

{/notice}


In the txt file I attach to the SOL Submission Wizard, I have the title, followed by the author name, followed by the chapter name, followed by the story.

Does the {notice} go before the chapter name or after it? I am not going to repeat the {notice} in all chapters.

Also, I modeled it after the formatting guidelines. Do I need the blank lines, like between {4}WARNING and the warning itself? Or even after the {notice}?

Replies:   robberhands  REP  Bondi Beach
robberhands

@Switch Blayde

I find it depressing that you think you need such a notice and even more depressing that you are probably right.

Switch Blayde

@robberhands

I find it depressing that you think you need such a notice


It could be a squick.

Replies:   robberhands
robberhands

@Switch Blayde

It could be a squick.

... and even more depressing that you are probably right.

REP

@Switch Blayde

Personally I would place the notice just before the story text. I would include whatever spacing and/or dividers I felt were appropriate to make it stand out and to make it clear the notice is not part of the text.

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Ross at Play

@robberhands

even more depressing that you are probably right.

"PC" is not necessarily incorrect. I choose not to another N-word either, except when referring to myself.

Replies:   robberhands
Switch Blayde
Updated:

@REP


to make it clear the notice is not part of the text.


That's why I want to put it before the chapter heading "Chapter 1"

I don't need a blank line between "warning" and the warning. I don't know if the Wizard system requires it.

Replies:   REP
robberhands

@Ross at Play

"PC" is not necessarily incorrect.

How does it serve political correctness to pretend that no one uses the N-word?

I'm just getting more and more depressed.

Replies:   Ross at Play
Ross at Play

@robberhands

I'm just suggesting there are times I don't object to annoyance/extra effort to be PC myself, whether others do or not.

BlacKnight

There's a difference between pretending racists don't exist, and not wanting to read stories about them.

REP

@Switch Blayde

I don't know if the SOL translator will allow something put before the chapter title line.

From what I've seen, once the Chapter, Author, and Copyright lines are presented, the translator treats everything else in your file as story text. Based on that, I don't think the Wizard/translator has any requirement related to how you format the warning. If you don't want a line, don't put one in.

Switch Blayde

@REP

I just sent the question to Webmaster. I'll report back with the answer.

Switch Blayde

@REP

The answer:

If you put it between the author name and the 'chapter 1' marker,
it will end up on the cover page.

If you want it in the first chapter, then put it below 'chapter
1' marker.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@Switch Blayde

The answer:

If you put it between the author name and the 'chapter 1' marker,
it will end up on the cover page.

If you want it in the first chapter, then put it below 'chapter
1' marker.

In your case, Switch, I'd probably do both, just to cover my ass. Place it on the cover page so it'll be obvious to anyone accessing the story, but also put it in the very first chapter, simply because most people utterly ignore the cover page.

Geek of Ages

Putting it on every chapter might be nice for those who find it via searching and thus jump to the middle.

Switch Blayde

@Geek of Ages

Putting it on every chapter might be nice for those who find it via searching and thus jump to the middle.


I thought about that, but to me anything below the chapter name is story (not about the story). I'm going to put it on the story page.

Ernest Bywater

I'd place it between the chapter title and the text. You could ask Lazeez about the placement if it really worries you.

Crumbly Writer

@Geek of Ages

Putting it on every chapter might be nice for those who find it via searching and thus jump to the middle.

Just to be safe, why don't you put it in every single chapter? In fact, why not just replace ALL the offensive text with the warning, and all the other text as well. Just have twelve chapters of nothing but warnings! :(

You want to cover yourself against those who are inherently stupid, as they typically complain the loudest, but there's no guarantee against the combination of stupid and arrogant, so I wouldn't get too carried away.

Geek of Ages, I realize you were teasing, but those kinds of responses always rile me up!

Replies:   Geek of Ages
Geek of Ages

@Crumbly Writer

I'm not teasing at all. I've been contemplating this very thing, as I have a story under consideration that would have a lot of squick material in it, and I'd rather not have someone going through the search to stumble in halfway through and encounter things without a content warning. So, I was probably going to include the warning on each chapter.

However, that's a lot of duplication, and I don't know how common a use case that is.

It would be nice if from the search there were a way to identify stories that have content warnings or something like that.

Making sure people can be aware of content warnings before they read stuff is, in my opinion, basic courtesy as an author.

REP
Updated:

@Geek of Ages


So, I was probably going to include the warning on each chapter.


I did that with an informational message in a 20+ chapter story. Richardshagrin found it irritating, when I updated the story, I took the hint and removed the extra messages.

Personally, most people start reading a story at Chapter 1, not in the middle.

The warning would definitely belong in the first chapter. If you want to repeat it, perhaps every third of fourth chapter would be more than adequate.

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Bondi Beach
Updated:

@Switch Blayde


Also, I modeled it after the formatting guidelines. Do I need the blank lines, like between {4}WARNING and the warning itself? Or even after the {notice}?


Between the {notice} and {/notice} you need normal formatting, i.e., skip lines, paragraphing or centering or whatever. I've put the {notice} on a separate line and skipped a line after just to ensure the text is clearly separated. I can't remember whether the formatting examples skip a line after the {notice}.

It doesn't have chapters, but I put a notice, a fun info piece, not a warning, between the "Show Story Details" and the story text in "Heather Among the Beagles."


A note to the moderators with your submission will ensure it gets put ahead of the first chapter, and ahead of the TOC, if that's what you want.

ETA: In "Stockings" the cover art and Notice appear between the Copyright line and the "Show Story Details" line.

bb

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Crumbly Writer

@Geek of Ages

I'm not teasing at all. I've been contemplating this very thing, as I have a story under consideration that would have a lot of squick material in it, and I'd rather not have someone going through the search to stumble in halfway through and encounter things without a content warning. So, I was probably going to include the warning on each chapter.

However, that's a lot of duplication, and I don't know how common a use case that is.

In that case, the typical response is to post a warning initially (so squicked readers know not to proceed), and then another on the chapters in question (so anyone already enjoying the story are warned and can skim over the chapter if they're bothered by it). That beats labeling each individual chapter. (That's how many handle cases of MM sex in SOL stories.)

Replies:   Geek of Ages
Switch Blayde

@Geek of Ages

It would be nice if from the search there were a way to identify stories that have content warnings or something like that.


There's the "warning" story tag.

But that isn't the reason for my warning. I've had readers think I was the character. I'm saying, "This is the character, not me."

Replies:   Geek of Ages
Switch Blayde

@REP

Richardshagrin found it irritating,


As would I. I also hate when the author summarizes the previous chapter in the beginning of the next chapter.

Replies:   awnlee jawking  REP
Switch Blayde

@Bondi Beach

between the "Show Story Details" and the story text in "Heather Among the Beagles."


Thanks for the link. That shows me what it would look like, except the chapter names would be after it (or maybe before it ... hmm)

Replies:   Bondi Beach
Bondi Beach

@Switch Blayde

Thanks for the link. That shows me what it would look like, except the chapter names would be after it (or maybe before it ... hmm)


In "Stockings" the cover art and Notice appear between the Copyright line and the "Show Story Details" line, followed by the chapter listing.

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Switch Blayde

@Bondi Beach

In "Stockings"


That shows the {notice} is before the chapter names which is good.
Thanks.

awnlee jawking

@Switch Blayde

I also hate when the author summarizes the previous chapter in the beginning of the next chapter.


If the summary is short and the author releases new chapters at intervals of a week or more, I think it's a good thing. It saves having to re-read the previous chapter to refamiliarise where the story has reached.

AJ

AmigaClone

@awnlee jawking


If the summary is short and the author releases new chapters at intervals of a week or more, I think it's a good thing.


In this situation, I would agree that a previous chapter summary would be a good idea. I would recommend that when the story was complete to remove those summaries.

awnlee_jawking
Updated:

@AmigaClone

In this situation, I would agree that a previous chapter summary would be a good idea. I would recommend that when the story was complete to remove those summaries.


(virtual thumbs up to show agreement)

AJ

Ross at Play

@awnlee_jawking


AJ

You seem unusually eloquent today. Have you finally succumbed to the lure of the Dark Side (minimalist)?

awnlee jawking

@Ross at Play

You seem unusually eloquent today. Have you finally succumbed to the lure of the Dark Side (minimalist)?


Oops, thanks for pointing that out.

No, my post succumbed to the 'everything in angular brackets is zapped if it's not in the subset of supported HTML'.

I've edited my post with the obliterated text in round brackets.

What a palaver to give a thumbs-up to someone ;)

AJ

robberhands

@awnlee jawking

What a palaver to give a thumbs-up to someone ;)

Is 'palaver' a rarely used term, something like a 100$ word?

Ernest Bywater

@awnlee jawking

If the summary is short and the author releases new chapters at intervals of a week or more, I think it's a good thing. It saves having to re-read the previous chapter to refamiliarise where the story has reached.


Except, in the long term, the majority of readers will be reading the chapters one after another without the break, and thus find it extremely boring repetition and will dump the story after a few chapters of constant repeats.

Ernest Bywater

@AmigaClone


In this situation, I would agree that a previous chapter summary would be a good idea. I would recommend that when the story was complete to remove those summaries.


they should be removed as soon as the next chapter is posted.

Ernest Bywater

@robberhands

Is 'palaver' a rarely used term, something like a 100$ word?


more of an archaic word for talking or discussion.

Replies:   graybyrd
graybyrd

@Ernest Bywater

More like Hollywood 40's & 50's movie westerns. The sheriff and the posse would sit down for a palaver; the redskins would hold a pow-wow. I think we've moved beyond that... mostly.

Geek of Ages

@Switch Blayde

There's the "warning" story tag.


You can't see story codes when searching. If you could, that would ameliorate my concerns, because the whole purpose of story codes is to be content warnings.

Geek of Ages

@Crumbly Writer

another on the chapters in question


In my case, that would be pretty much every chapter, and even the ones that wouldn't have it explicitly would be very much discussing it.

I don't know if I want to write the story, though. I'm not sure my reputation could recover. ;)

awnlee jawking

@robberhands

Is 'palaver' a rarely used term, something like a 100$ word?


Prolonged or tedious fuss or discussion. I used it in the 'fuss' sense.

It used to be relatively common in my childhood (UK English) but it has dropped out of fashion. I can't remember seeing it used in US English.

So yes, regrettably it's now a $100 word.

Send my $100 to ... ;)

AJ

Geek of Ages

@awnlee jawking

I would consider "palaver" a rare word, except in fantasy literature. There's also a chat client named that, so I don't think it's that obscure.

robberhands
Updated:

@awnlee jawking

Send my $100 to ... ;)

Nope, I used it first and got the prize.

fwarant @robberhands -

Kenn's mentioned before that English isn't your first language. Yet I see espy (I have seen this one before) and palaver (new one to me) in one chapter. Two google searches in one chapter. Impressive.

Crumbly Writer

@awnlee_jawking

In this situation, I would agree that a previous chapter summary would be a good idea. I would recommend that when the story was complete to remove those summaries.

I ran up against this when posting my six book series (featuring real books, not just excessively long chapters). I only summarized the previous books so readers could catch up quickly, but I found it necessary (with previous chapter summaries, at least) to remove the summary portion after I'd posted the initial chapter posting subsequent chapters. In the end, trying to keep up with the summaries ensured I never again issued summaries in the first place.

It's better to handle summaries in the text themselves (say having the characters discussion past events between themselves, recasting what happened previously within the scope of what they face in the current story).

Replies:   Not_a_ID
Ross at Play

@awnlee jawking

What a palaver to give a thumbs-up to someone ;)

Actually, I thought you'd done it deliberately intending it as a thumbs up. And as I said, I thought you'd managed to express yourself eloquently. :-)

Ross at Play

@robberhands

Is 'palaver' a rarely used term, something like a 100$ word?

The OED says the meaning is different for BrE and AmE!

palaver noun
(informal)

1 [uncountable, singular] (British English) a lot of unnecessary activity, excitement or trouble, especially caused by something that is unimportant
SYNONYM fuss
What's all the palaver about?
What a palaver it is, trying to get a new visa!

2 [uncountable] (North American English) talk that does not have any meaning; nonsense
He's talking palaver.

- Oxford Advanced Learner's Dictionary 9th edition © Oxford University Press, 2015

Replies:   robberhands
robberhands

@Ross at Play

The OED says the meaning is different for BrE and AmE!

Well, I used it in the AmE meaning of the term. The funny island folks can swim or sink with it, for all I care.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer

@robberhands

The funny island folks can swim or sink with it, for all I care.

"Funny island folk" cover a lot of different regions, most of which are not terribly humorous. 'D

Replies:   robberhands
robberhands

@Crumbly Writer

"Funny island folk" cover a lot of different regions, most of which are not terribly humorous. 'D

If that's the case, they shouldn't read my story anyway.

awnlee jawking

@Ross at Play

minimalist


I'm not obsessed with making my stories cleaner, stronger, whiter, with healthier gums ;)

AJ

Switch Blayde
Updated:

@awnlee jawking


It saves having to re-read the previous chapter to refamiliarise where the story has reached.


That's the crux of it. I write a story as if someone is reading a full story even if I post it a chapter at a time. You'd never see that in a purchased paperback. As a reader, I don't start a story until it is complete. When I start the next chapter I want to jump into what's going to happen next, not what already happened.

I see where it's necessary the way stories are posted to SOL. Now knowing about the {notice}, that would be the place to summarize the previous chapter. It could easily be skipped over.

Switch Blayde

@AmigaClone

I would recommend that when the story was complete to remove those summaries.


If the summary was in the {notice} that would be simple to do.

robberhands
Updated:

@Switch Blayde

I write a story as if someone is reading a full story even if I post it a chapter at a time. You'd never see that in a purchased paperback. As a reader, I don't start a story until it is complete.

What an refreshingly easy acknowledgement of opposing interests between authors posting stories on SoL and their readers.

I noticed one of my readers favorite tools to take revenge on me for posting chapter by chapter, is to accuse me of 'cliffhanger endings' after pretty much every part I submited.

Maybe pretending to have a bad memory and demanding summaries is another one.

Not_a_ID

@awnlee jawking

If the summary is short and the author releases new chapters at intervals of a week or more, I think it's a good thing. It saves having to re-read the previous chapter to refamiliarise where the story has reached.


I would be "somewhat" ok with that. But only On the condition that the author will eventually go back and remove those summaries from "much older chapters." So they don't get annoying when someone like myself comes along and does a "binge" on the story from start to present and has to wade through a summary/recap on every
chapter.

The "other reason" for that being vexing is it pads the word count(other sites) and file size(here) as well. When size happens to be part of the selection criteria being used, finding a significant fraction of that to be completely irrelevant doesn't help endear me to the author.

Not_a_ID

@Crumbly Writer

It's better to handle summaries in the text themselves (say having the characters discussion past events between themselves, recasting what happened previously within the scope of what they face in the current story).


That can get highly annoying too if it happens multiple times in the same book.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
REP

@Switch Blayde

Yes, it can. The author repeating one or two sentences as a lead-in isn't too bad.

I'm reading many stories, I tend to get them confused. When a new chapter is posted, I usually go to the end of the prior chapter to refresh my memory as to where the author left off.

Crumbly Writer

@Switch Blayde

That's the crux of it. I write a story as if someone is reading a full story even if I post it a chapter at a time. You'd never see that in a purchased paperback. As a reader, I don't start a story until it is complete. When I start the next chapter I want to jump into what's going to happen next, not what already happened.

That's why those of us who do as you do—complete the story before posting—schedule the posts close enough together that readers are unlikely to forget what happened. The problem is, for serial writers who write as they progress, they often fall behind as real life intervenes, and thus a week soon turns into two, then into a month and soon into a couple of months.

Crumbly Writer

@Not_a_ID

It's better to handle summaries in the text themselves (say having the characters discussion past events between themselves, recasting what happened previously within the scope of what they face in the current story).

That can get highly annoying too if it happens multiple times in the same book.

It's better to handle summaries in the text themselves (say having the characters discussion past events between themselves, recasting what happened previously within the scope of what they face in the current story).

That's why it's best as the first chapter (prologue) in a sequel, so it's not too painful to read while refreshing the readers' memories. It won't work at all for an ongoing serial.

Replies:   Switch Blayde
Switch Blayde

@Crumbly Writer

having the characters discussion past events between themselves,


Those aren't the summaries I'm talking about. Often, someone repeats at the start of a chapter what happened in the last paragraph or two of the previous chapter.

I understand why. So they don't have to go back and read the end of the previous chapter. I just find it annoying when the story is complete.

The solution is easy. Use the {notice} and keep removing them when the next chapter is posted.

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